A commenter on www.facebook.com, Karen G. Lee has offered criticism of Occidentalism. I just want to show this without commenting to much. I want Occidentalism readers to give their opinions on this.

I am partly shocked, frustrated, and mostly saddened by this forum. And I am saying this as a person, and not as a Korean citizen and definitely NOT as a Korean nationalist. I know that there’s 2ch, a Japanese forum that openly attacks Korea and holds extreme anti-Korean comments, but wow, even in English sites! I didn’t know such thing existed; A site full of extreme cynicism and full of distort and devaluation about Korea.

What I found funny from this site is though, I wouldn’t mine if this site openly claims that it is an anti-Korean site; however, it continuously denies its role of degrading Korea. They always say “how is this site degrading Korea?” And they try to justify it. Funny, even non-Koreans found and noticed that one post after another held negative comments about Korea and offensive materials. It’s also funny that Koreans can’t really express their views openly because, one occasion, pro-Korean view was expressed, and that person was labeled as a troll, comments got deleted, and later got kicked out. So how is that a forum that opens up a diverse discussion? if pro-Korean ideas (and not even downright korean nationalistic view but mere facts and statistics),they say, “you must be a Korean liar, ultra-Korean nationalist”, or “I smell Kimuchi…”

And I found this even more scary, that these people have extensive data, which are very one-sided researched, got off from anti-Korean sites, or news about Korea that only shows very negative parts of Korea, or some are just downright stupid, downright subjective, and downright anti-korean (but ironically, they are never trolls, Nope Nope). For people new to Korea, it is possible that they might believe these threads and find them legitimate and true. Because believe it or not, they do present their discussions logically, but very anti-Korean and some very subjective. I am afraid that people who don’t know Korea will see Korea through these peoples’ one-sided comments.

Interestingly, they NEVER say they hate Korea outright. They all pose as nice and intelligent guys that are trying to show Other side of Korea and say they are trying to open up Koreans’ narrow minded views, Koreas are copy, dirty nation, degrade our historical heros(and these are the partly better comments by them), but underneath, they say all the offensive and negative comments they could think of! The cynicism is very much embedded. And it makes me truly disgusted. (by now I am definitely labeled as an ultra korean-nationalist! according to them! lol,,,)

Also, obviously these people have way too much interest in Korea, and they seem to know more Korean history than I do. (well, but sadly, only the very negative parts). I am not really sure what they are trying to promote… and trying to get out of through degrading and stepping on another person’s nation.

But, honestly, I never knew that Korea was this much hated and ridiculed. It really upsets me. Their comments really made me tear up and cry.

(And not only here, but also in youtube..have you noticed that anything, and i mean anything bad happens in Korea, it could be any country too, but these videos are posted in youtube like 5 mintues later with Japanese writings on it??? and they are probably not even Japanese, or perhaps they are,,,we can never know). Is Korea really that bad? Did we really do so much wrong to you people? Why do people work so hard making up anti-korean videos? why do they spend so much time spreading hate into this world? seriously I didn’t want to go this far, but these feelings have been accumulated over some times.

Well, please I really suggest people to check out this site! And judge for yourselves. And read their comments!

http://www.occidentalism.o

rg/

Thanks for the post about the Gerry B guy. < --- this man is a very active member in this forum.. the ELS english teacher that did not get his contract renewal due to dokdo issue. (he also write about very one-sided dokdo views extensivley).

Ironically, he kept (and this is his defense) saying in his posts that he loves Korean people, and Korea. But honestly, how can he say that when he spends hours and hours trying to disprove and break what every Korean holds so dearly? How can he say that when he spends hours and hours trying to break Korean image, distort Korean history by displaying only one extreme view? Why not at least present both korean and japanese sides? not just Japanese? he is a bigot and his motives are clearly designed to slander Korea... no??

Honestly, how is that loving Korea?

The only thing I will say is that people with opposing opinions do not get banned here, and she is sadly and unfortunately mistaken about that. I am posting here because I am unable to comment over there.

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Posted by Matt, filed under Rants. Date: January 17, 2007, 2:29 am | 39 Comments »

39 Responses

  1. pacifist Says:

    Obviously she is misunderstanding Occidentalism.

    She seems to be one of the Korea lovers, so negative opinions towards Korea may seem to be “distorted”, but we just want Korea to be fair and democratic country as Korea lovers.

    Korea has various problems, it maybe a process of a pre-democratic country to be true democratic country. But it is our duty to point out what is the problem, if they can’t notice it.

    Matt didn’t exclude Korean opinions, he only stopped the rude persons who kept writing rude words.

  2. chul_soo Says:

    it only proves that this blog is getting more attention and fame! matt must be doing something right as a blogger.

  3. Matt Says:

    it only proves that this blog is getting more attention and fame! matt must be doing something right as a blogger.

    Actually, Occidentalism was linked on Michelle Malkin’s blog today. People are starting to pay attention.

  4. ponta Says:

    it continuously denies its role of degrading Korea.

    Don’t degrade Korea, Korea is a strong nation, capable of listening to reasonable discussions.

    It’s also funny that Koreans can’t really express their views openly because, one occasion, pro-Korean view was expressed, and that person was labeled as a troll, comments got deleted, and later got kicked out. So how is that a forum that opens up a diverse discussion? if pro-Korean ideas (and not even downright korean nationalistic view but mere facts and statistics),they say, “you must be a Korean liar, ultra-Korean nationalist”, or “I smell Kimuchi…”

    This is a sly way of degrading this blog.

    And I found this even more scary, that these people have extensive data, which are very one-sided researched, got off from anti-Korean sites, or news about Korea that only shows very negative parts of Korea, or some are just downright stupid, downright subjective, and downright anti-korean

    Extensive and yet one-sided? Or extensive data which she does not want to believe?

    For people new to Korea, it is possible that they might believe these threads and find them legitimate and true. Because believe it or not, they do present their discussions logically, but very anti-Korean and some very subjective.

    People are not so stupid to try to understand Korea only through this blog. But interesting, she admits our discussion is logical.
    but anti-Korean? No, just one aspect of Korea that few Koreans dare to speak out. Sujective? not really. Objective ? not really. but open to further discussion.

    They all pose as nice and intelligent guys that are trying to show Other side of Korea and say they are trying to open up Koreans’ narrow minded views,

    ???? So does she also pose as nice and intelligent woman that tried to show the essence of this blog and she is trying to open up this blog’s narrow minded views?

    underneath, they say all the offensive and negative comments they could think of! The cynicism is very much embedded. And it makes me truly disgusted. (by now I am definitely labeled as an ultra korean-nationalist! according to them! lol,,,)

    Underneath she felt criticizing Korea is offensive and disgusting. I reserve the judgement whether she is ultra-nationalist yet.

    Also, obviously these people have way too much interest in Korea, and they seem to know more Korean history than I do.

    Being spitted by the whole nation, from the kids to the politicians, form education to the media , will surely prompt some person to be interested in the nation who is spitting.

    trying to get out of through degrading and stepping on another person’s nation.

    Exactly…… except it is not what this blog is doing but that is what Korea has been doing.

    Did we really do so much wrong to you people?

    It is interesting that this person does not realize what Korea has been doing. There are racist idiots in every nations, but in Korea from the kids to politicians, from the education to politics, they are anti-Japan, filled with myth. And yet she does not mention it. It seems to be difficult for her to realize Korea is spitting but it seems to be offensive for her to be pointed out she is spitting.

    Well, please I really suggest people to check out this site! And judge for yourselves. And read their comments!

    I agree.

    (he also write about very one-sided dokdo views extensivley).

    I’d say this is very unfair way to assess his posts; she does not even present argument!!

    how can he say that when he spends hours and hours trying to disprove and break what every Korean holds so dearly? How can he say that when he spends hours and hours trying to break Korean image, distort Korean history by displaying only one extreme view?

    How can he love Korea without pointing out the false believe Korea holds so dearly? One is bigot if he loves Korea and he does not do that.

    How can he say that when he spends hours and hours trying to break Korean image, distort Korean history by displaying only one extreme view? Why not at least present both korean and japanese sides? not just Japanese?

    I am not sure if Gerry represent Japan’s view. I am not sure he is familiar with Japan’s view either. But I don’t think he is distorting Korean history. How can she say such a thing if she admit the posters
    know much better on Korean history?

    he is a bigot and his motives are clearly designed to slander Korea… no??

    NO.

    Honestly, how is that loving Korea?

    Well you love somebody, and he drinks too much to the point of damaging his health, you gonna tell him not drink too much.The same thing, I guess.

    .

  5. Travolta Says:

    She seems like a nice enough person. However she suffers the unfortunate disease of all nationalists no matter which nation they hail from. This is to equate criticism (no matter how true) with racism/distortion. She commented that Gerry says he loves Korea but obviously can’t because he opposes Korean arguments about Dokdo.

    This is the biggest problem anyone encounters when discussing anything with nationalistic people. They place their concept of nation so far above logic and rational thought and open mindedness that they are incapable of making a distinction between criticism and racism. In their minds any criticism must be a form of hate.

    I truly believe Gerry does love Korea and that is exactly the reason he writes about Dokdo the way he does. Gerry doesn’t want to see Korea fail, I think he wants Korea to blossom and for that to happen, blind nationalism must make way for rational and open discussion. The fact the reviewer could not understand this simple concept is the reason so many people come away from their time in Korea with anger and unfortunately (and equally as irrational as the nationalists I here criticise), racist thoughts. It is infuriatingly difficult to suggest change or introduce criticism in a place were both are frowned upon and taken as insults and an affront to one’s existence/heritage.

    I honestly would like to see Korea succeed and for its general populace to enter the age of reason and open discussion about culture, history and its relationship with its neigbours. I am afraid however that such times are hiding in the distant future and they are openly and widely stalled by the social ills of blind nationalism, irrational concepts of heritage and illogical Confucian views of society and history.

    I would like to thank the reviewer for taking the time to read some of the posts on this site and I hope she comes back as often as possible to continue reading and hopefully find that most of us actually like Korea but feel it needs some positive change which certainly doesn’t seem to be coming from within.

  6. Fantasy Says:

    She seems like a nice enough person.

    Yes, it seems so. I tried to write a gentle comment in reply to her post, in order to convince her of our true intentions, but did not manage.

    Did not manage to find out how to post there, I mean…

    Maybe I’m stupid…

  7. Two Cents Says:

    Is Korea really that bad? Did we really do so much wrong to you people?

    Well, let me just say if all the negative propaganda about my country Japan had not been coming out of Korea, I would not even have cared about Korea. It would have been just another country, like Belgium – no offense meant to the Belgiums; it’s just that to me, Belgium is a country of delicious chocolates, just as Korea used to be the land of kimchi. No more, no less. One of my great grandmother comes from an ancient clan that moved to the Japanese archipelago a long, long time ago, even before Kyoto was built. When I didn’t know much about Korea, I had a warmer feeling towards Korea, as countries that some of your ancestors came from tend to make you feel. Like the emperor, I had felt a certain closeness, or “yukari (縁)” as you might say in Japanese. That is why when the textbook issue came up, I initially thought that Korea must have a solid basis for their loud complaints, since when a democratic country (one with freedom of speech unlike China) speaks out like that, they must have. Those days are long gone. And it’s not the anti-Korean sites that made me feel this way, but the BS on pro-Korean and Korean sites. Now I am glad that the clan whose blood runs partly in me had the foresight to get the entire clan out of the peninsula.

    pacifist,

    Matt didn’t exclude Korean opinions, he only stopped the rude persons who kept writing rude words.

    People tend to see only what they want to see. You would be amazed at how perceptions of one incident can be totally different between different people. An extreme rightist will scream “what a left-winger” and an extreme leftist will scream “what a right-winger” at the same comment. The person who wrote this opinion about Occidentalism, while saying that “I am saying this as a person, and not as a Korean citizen,” it’s prettly clear from her writing that she is taking it personally as a Korean.

  8. zst192 Says:

    You never knew Korea was this much hated and ridiculed? This site made you cry? How do you think a lot of Japanese feel about Koreans and Chinese who teach their children that Japanese people are all devils?

    I am Japanese, and seeing something like this:

    http://uqmgp.hp.infoseek.co.jp/

    just makes me feel sick inside. It’s one thing for adults to have these kinds of views, but seeing children being encouraged to draw things like this is just so sad.

    Korea is not the only country being “attacked”, just so you know.

  9. HanComplex Says:

    What Travolta said. I think in this reviewer’s mind:

    Criticism of Korea = Anti-Korean

    So true of what you said about nationalists putting the worship of their country above rational and logical thought. What happens next is, since they do not want to or unable to apply critical thinking in an argument, the response ends up being mostly an emotional and irrational one. Instead of gaining insight to both sides of the debate, they only see one side and refuse to see (or even acknowledge the existence of) the opposing viewpoint. That’s not really conducive to forming a well thought-out conclusion, is it now.

    From what she wrote, Ms. Lee seems sincere though. I hope she continues to come here with a more open mind and even participate in the discussions. Eventually she’ll learn that criticizing Korea does not necessarily mean being anti-Korean.

  10. James Says:

    It’s pretty sad that she automatically equates Gerry’s criticism of the Dokdo issue as hatred against Koreans. After all, it is Korean nationalists who have made the Dokdo issue into a rallying point for hatred of the Japanese. If killing Korea’s historical claim on the islets with post after post of simple evidence and logic-based analysis is racism, I guess he’s racist.

  11. Nemachi Amame Says:

    What she said here are the only emotional, just the same with such expressions that Korean nationalistic people are all the time trying to repeat with no effort to go through the facts. She seems to me to be either a somewhat skilled commenter who can pretend anyway or an idle woman who doesn’t want to spend studying the facts.

    I am a Japanese man who was once so shocked and embarrassed to see that Koreans’ behaviors especially against Japan、and that such were not grounded at all but just merely being based on hatred or contempt, or superiority. I then decided to study history and English to speak out to people over the world what are lies and half-truths, like Mr. Gerry-Bevers is now posting. What I am in need are the facts.

    Ms Karen G. Lee,I below indicate some facts though I am 100% sure that you will flattery deny all or try to do your best to ignore all. Some were said by Ponta some days back.

    At Tojo Hideki cabinet in 1943, our Japanese army recruited 6,000 volunteers in the Korean Peninsula annexed to Japan and over 300,000 Koreans there applied to it. In 1942, they were 4,000 and over 250,000 individually. The list below is the record. 14 Korean young men joined Kamikaze Attack Units to die for Japan and all died with their bombers. Over 250,000 Korean men went to the fronts and fought as Japanese officers and solders. Koreans and Japanese then shared pitiable lives on the battlefield, and over 22,000 Koreans and 2,300,000 Japanese died in the war.

    Year Applicants Accepted Ratio
    1938 2496 406 7.7
    1939 12,348 613 20.1
    1940 84,443 3,060 27.6
    1941 144,743 3,208 45.1
    1942 254,273 4,077 62.4
    1943 303,394 6,300 48.2
    http://toron.pepper.jp/jp/20cf/image/bosyuu.gif

    They lived short but they should have expected their lives presented to be for the descendants of Japan and Korea. Their soul and spirit has been enshrined at Yasukuni and venerated as the heroes to fight to protect the families and the countries. Here is no difference between Japan and Korea or among their ranks at the wartime.

    Thinking them over, I just can hardly control myself from wailing.

  12. Emmanuel_Chanel Says:

    Oh… The introducer was the husband of the Japanese woman that I introduced to this blog. He is a sitter of Michelle Malkin during her absense. I don’t know why the Japanese woman found this blog, though.(Via me?)
    I hope that your blog is getting much more famous.

  13. Emmanuel_Chanel Says:

    The introducer = the person who links Michelle Malkin to Occidentalism on http://michellemalkin.com/archives/006710.htm

  14. wiesunja Says:

    zst192

    I am Japanese, and seeing something like this:

    http://uqmgp.hp.infoseek.co.jp/

    just makes me feel sick inside. It’s one thing for adults to have these kinds of views, but seeing children being encouraged to draw things like this is just so sad.

    Korea is not the only country being “attacked”, just so you know.

    Oh, no…but you forget…to the Korean mind, attacking and making filthy disgusting offensive comments about Japan or other foreign countries is perfectly OK. It’s only when foreigners give Koreans a taste of their own medicine that it is bad. This is the hypocritical nature of the Korean brain explained perfectly to a T.

    Karen Lee whined…

    But, honestly, I never knew that Korea was this much hated and ridiculed. It really upsets me. Their comments really made me tear up and cry.

    Hahaha…no pity from me at all. Get used to it. Koreans should learn that besides the foreigners that you bribe with money to go on Korean TV and spit out disgusting fawning statements praising Korea as the most superior nation on Earth, the reality is that Korea really is a joke and laughing stock of a nation to most people who really understand the ugly truth and hypocrisy of Korea and Korean people. The more Koreans reveal the truth about themselves and their ugly, immature, ignorant ways, the more Korea will be hated and ridiculed. Don’t blame others like Occidentalism, Japan, America, China or any foreigner power. YOU KOREANS have only YOURSELVES to blame for your own demise. You Koreans did this to yourselves and have noone else to blame. Instead of acting like a 5 year old child who always points his/her finger at others when being criticized, Korea should act like a mature adult and accept self-criticism. Oh, but then again…asking Korea to act like a mature nation? That would be asking too much.

    Furthermore Karen, you said you cried reading about the hurtful comments about Korea? What a typical Korean you are..selfish and only thinking about yourself as a victim. The sheer number of hate sites devoted to hating Japapn, China or the USA that are made by YOUR countrymen outnumber any anti-Korea site 1000 to 1. Believe me, it would take a long, long, long time before the number of hate sites devoted to attacking Korea could even reach 1/100th of the number of filthy, profanity ladedn anti-Japan sites started by ugly Koreans. Comparing the number of sites on which Korea is criticized vs. the number of barbaric hate sites run by Koreans for the purpose of ridiculing other nations is like comparing the number of ice storms in the Sahara desert to ice storms in the Antarctica. Give me a break no real civilized logical thinking person is going to buy your line of BS that Korean are innocent, non-offensive people who mind their own business and just get attacked for no reason. You Koreans own the monopoly of promoting hatred, bigotry and racist filth on the internet and anyone with a brain and a computer knows that it is true. Frankly, Koreans like you disgust me with your deceitful lies. You Koreans always love to dish it out making thousands of anti-Japan hate sites after hate sites on the internet, but scream like a raging monkey once you discover one little counter attack. Cowards…total cowards.

  15. sqz Says:

    For example:

    レストランが禁煙であることを知らない客がタバコを吸おうとした時、店員が注意しました。
    When the visitor who did not know that nobody can smoke in a restaurant was going to smoke, a salesclerk was careful.
    店員はこの客が嫌いなのでしょうか?
    Did a salesclerk hate this visitor?

    きっと店員は「好きですヨ」と言うでしょうね。
    Surely, a salesclerk will say “I love you”.

  16. jaebea Says:

    wiesunja, I think I love you.

    Karen said :

    Ironically, he kept (and this is his defense) saying in his posts that he loves Korean people, and Korea. But honestly, how can he say that when he spends hours and hours trying to disprove and break what every Korean holds so dearly?

    Not me. I couldn’t care if the goddamn rocks sank into the ocean right now, taking that ridiculous police station with it.

    Jesus. If she’s so concerned with a bunch of rocks that she probably has never seen, and probably never will, what difference does it make if a foreign educated academic, the very same foreign education that both her and her family probably take IMMENSE pride in after living in her great North American home, raises a few questions about the legitimacy of the Korean claim?

    “Holds so dearly”. With that throwaway line, she’s made an assumption that undermines her entire comment about this site. How dare she lump me with her and her own self righteous interests.

    The fact that this site sparks outrage in her only confirms the fact that there are aspects of Korea that don’t always smell like roses. Rather than be deniers of this, any TRUE patriotic Korean would be doing their damned best to rectify these issues, instead of masturbating over how hot “Bi” is, wondering what’s going to happen in the next installment of the drama series they’re following, and complaining about a bunch of igneous rocks in the middle of the fucking sea.

  17. YoshoMasaki Says:

    Ummmm ……. I don’t think this girl has a pot to piss in on the moral high road. She is posting in the Facebook group “Dokdo Belongs To Korea”, a group which (as its home page) features a declaration that Dokdo “was once called Usando” – a bold-faced lie which Gerry-Bevers has bebunked back to the Stone Age. The group ws also forced to recently post this policy:

    From now on, please observe the following rules:

    1. No racism. If you call anyone a “Jap,” you will probably be banned. I looked on the list of racial slurs ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wi
    ki/Racial_slurs ) and I didn’t see “Chosun,” but since someone complained about this, let’s refrain from using that also.

    2. Stay on topic. This isn’t the place to discuss whether Japan is militaristic, war criminals, comfort women, etc. There are other groups for that.

    3. Don’t spam. Don’t spam the board, the wall, or the members (including me). This will get you banned, and probably slapped if we meet in real life.

    4. Discussion and debate are encouraged, but keep it in the forums and on the wall. Don’t upload pics that would be contrary to the group’s message. Also, try to avoid mere propaganda in making arguments; there’s far too much of that on both sides at the moment.

    As a side note, avoid nationalism. This includes Japanese, Korean, American, Chinese, etc. nationalism. Wars aren’t often caused by nationalism, but they are certainly fueled by it. Since this topic is nationally charged, I won’t ban you for this, but if you say something stupid, I will probably make fun of you.

    (THIS IS NOT AN ANTI-JAPANESE GROUP. Do not act as if it is. We exist to raise awareness of an issue that has been overlooked in history.)

    Apparently you can’t get Koreans or their nationalist apologizers to talk about Dokdo without racism-fueled (and notably irrelevant) anti-Japanese commentary. Might this have something to do with the fact that the same people who hate “Japs” also have an unhealthy obsession with Takeshima?

    Despite the “policy”, anti-Japanese rhetoric dominates the forum and group page postings. One poster on their forum boasts:

    Topic: Takeshima is liberated from Racist Japanese trolls

    I have occupied his “Takeshima” group on behalf of the Dokdo Belongs to Korea group from the racist Japanese nationalist Joe Shimizu, who is now banned from facebook.com

    This group will also serve as a mirror to the Dokdo group.

    A racist, hypocritical nationalist proclaims victory only when he censors opposing opinion. I suppose his member is swelling with pride

  18. YoshoMasaki Says:

    at this latest accomplishment.

  19. polysics Says:

    whats goin on in heeeeeaaah!!? good points everyone

  20. polysics Says:

    and I’m sure that matt has a hate on for korean society. but all his posts are pretty well thought out and justified. most of the time

  21. kenyan98 Says:

    Korea is a great country…this is true! BUT, when are they going to stop crying and grow up?

    It is always someone that caused whatever heart ache they are talking about. Blame the Japanese, blame the US, blame anyone and not themselves. The problems are caused by others and NOT Koreans.

    This is their attitude. This is the way the justify their feelings for everyone.

    Sure, the US has had done some stupid things in this country and when we do, its all over the news. Americans who try to do something nice and helps the average Korean (and it happends everyday) is never reported. All anyone hears is how we are hurting them and never trying to help them.

    So they are always the victim. They are always getting stepped on. But when N. Koreans who try to get away from their hell-hole of a country are being sold out by their family (S. Korea) what does that show? Why is that 6 out 10 N. Koreans request to go to America and not S. Korea? Because they are treated like trash. They are treated like 2nd class citizens. Now, if you are treated like crap by other nations and people, don’t you think you are able to help the next guy out? Don’t you think you can be simpathetic to the guy who had it worse than you? Koreans want to be on top of the world and be the masters of your domain as long as the road ahead does not have any bumps or holes. If there are bumps/holes, then they automatically say that someone is trying to hurt them. I can go on forever writing about this.

    BUT there are good and bad in everything. There are many wonderful Koreans that will rise and meet the challenge. I know…my family is full of them. My grandfather survived what the Japanese and N. Koreans did to his family. He never once complained. He never said that it was anyone elses fault. He took things in stride and met every challenge. He led a great life and kept his honor. That is what Korea is losing…their Honor!

    Drop the act, open your eyes and life will have to get better. Remember who your friends and enemies are. Never get them mixed up.

    If this comment didn’t make much sense, I am sorry….emotions tend to do that when writing.

  22. Paul89 Says:

    what about the flow chart showing korean problem solving, is that also done through extensive research? This site would have a lot of potential if it would offer both sides of the arguement, but sadly it doesn’t.

  23. Fantasy Says:

    This site would have a lot of potential if it would offer both sides of the arguement, but sadly it doesn’t.

    Hello Paul89:

    The problem is that only few Koreans have the ability to offer their views in a reasonable manner. Everything in Korea is so one-sided…

    And, you see, about the Doktdo issue, the Koreans and their supporters have put their case so forcefully elsewhere, why should not the other side of the story be presented here ?

  24. MarkA Says:

    Paul89, just print that flowchart on a sheet of clear transparency film and you’ll see both sides of it.

  25. wrangler Says:

    Gerry,

    As an avid reader of The Marmot’s Hole, I have on occasion had the opportunity to view linked blogs for one reason or another. Your site came up and I have been reading it for a few months, going over various topics and reading the comments.

    At first I could not decide whether you were open to discussion as you say or just feeling negative about certain aspects of Korean society. I found some of your comments hilarious and spot on, according to my observations in Korea during my stay here. Coming from Tokyo most recently where I spent the better part of the last decade, it was interesting to see your comments and views of other readers. At least initially.

    Sorry to be blunt but I think I’ve come to the end of my tether with your blog here. Japan was definitely a love/hate affair for me (confession: I still own an apartment there) and Korea is proving to be the same. President Roh drives me nuts, the press is asinine and the traffic is terrible. I can’t decide whether the idiot right wing in Japan is any worse than the idiot right wing here in Korea. It could be that both are marginalised in society and well, just idiotic.

    Be that as it may, I really enjoyed my time in Japan and am finding myself enjoying Korea as well. Sure, there are irritants but I’ve yet to find a country I’ve lived in (of which there are many) which is devoid of its’ share of beefs. We’d all be better off sharing the love and communicating in constructive ways.

    I don’t get the sense you are particularly enjoying Korea these days. I could be wrong, but I do know I’m not having any fun reading your blog these days given all the hateful comments.

    Good luck with your wrongful dismissal case and try to lighten up!

  26. GarlicBreath Says:

    James Said:

    It’s pretty sad that she automatically equates Gerry’s criticism of the Dokdo issue as hatred against Koreans. After all, it is Korean nationalists who have made the Dokdo issue into a rallying point for hatred of the Japanese. If killing Korea’s historical claim on the islets with post after post of simple evidence and logic-based analysis is racism, I guess he’s racist

    .

    There are island disputes among many nations. Heck even Canada has a dispute over an island called Hans. But for the most part almost all these nations who have island disputes can act civil about it. (there are a few notible exceptions)

    This kyopo woman, openly admits she knows little about the issue but just believes that Takeshima is Korean without even a question. She is thinking with her blood. To small minded racists like her, any body who questions Koreans claim to Takeshima must be a racist.

    What a small minded idiot. She, like her dirty kyopo kin JK/WJK/Nulji etc. cannot think beyond their blood.

    I think, like Jaebae points out, that those who truely love Korea point out its problems in hope of changing them for the better. In this regard, I can clearly say that I love Korea more then the dirty dirty Kyopo’s like H Kim, JK, WJK and Nulji.

    (by the way, when I say dirty Kyopo, I dont mean that all kyopos are dirty just the ones I have named)

  27. beechtreem Says:

    She keeps using the term “anti-Korean”. Only a few countries in the world possess this weird concept. There’s anti-American, anti-Israeli, anti-Japanese, and anti-Korean. (maybe a few more but hardly that many.) For example, I’ve never really heard of anti-Italian, anti-Canadian or anti-Malaysian. If an Italian accused a foreigner of being anti-Italian, I think the Italians around him would break out laughing. Thats because there is a healthy sense of free-speech in Italy and most other countries. I wonder what these nations have in common that they have this concept of the anti-self. Paranoia and an underlying fascist-totalitarian belief-structure, I would say.

  28. Deer Hunter Says:

    ‘The problem is that only few Koreans have the ability to offer their views in a reasonable manner. Everything in Korea is so one-sided…’

    ‘In this regard, I can clearly say that I love Korea more then the dirty dirty Kyopo’s like H Kim, JK, WJK and Nulji.’

    Very sad…

  29. Paul89 Says:

    The problem is that only few Koreans have the ability to offer their views in a reasonable manner. Everything in Korea is so one-sided…

    And, you see, about the Doktdo issue, the Koreans and their supporters have put their case so forcefully elsewhere, why should not the other side of the story be presented here ?

    hi Fantasy, even if it were the case that Koreans may be one-sided on certain issues, who says the counter arguing side has to do the same? fight fire with fire? If everything in Korea is so one sided, how come there are different political parties, doesnt that show difference in opinions?

    About the dokdo issue, I understand why koreans are so emotional about it. They are suffering under an inferiority complex and the fear of Japanese colonialism. If Japan suddenly starts making new land claims in Korea, this upsets the population. It would be as if Germany would start making land claims in Poland or Czeckoslovakia again.

    I’m all for the other side of the story, im all for a balanced view, heck I don’t even mind strong opinions leaning against a certain side. But, the commentary by Karen G. Lee is very true in that this website has a anti-Korean vibe. If this weren’t the case, where is the other side defending Korea when public opinion is against it? Such as dog eating or cheating in the world cup 2002?

  30. beechtreem Says:

    a anti-Korean vibe.

    its a ridiculous concept. A real thought-stopper. Like anti-American. Grow-up.

    If this weren’t the case, where is the other side defending Korea when public opinion is against it? Such as dog eating or cheating in the world cup 2002?

    I suppose Kim Ki-duk is anti-Korean too since all his films focus on troubling issues in Korean society. Maybe, by your arguement, he should make a light-hearted comedy about how a team of geriatrics kicked cancer and won a baseball tournament by eating organic free-range dog-meat, to redeem himself. But Kim Ki-duk is Korean, so I guess he can’t be anti-Korean? Is this term reserved only for foreigners?

  31. Errol Says:

    Paul89 Said:

    January 18, 2007 at 12:10 pm

    If everything in Korea is so one sided, how come there are different political parties, doesn’t that show difference in opinions?

    Such naïveté about the Korean political system. There is only one side. The actual distribution of seats in the National Assembly shifts as members frequently switch among parties.

    The side of the pseudo-yangban and their domination of the Korean economy and education system. An education system that has produced the Liancourt Rocks’ Fraud.

    In the Republic of Korea’s hierarchical system the most successful person becomes topdog. He is the sky and everybody else is the earth.

    A brief review of the most successful politicians in the ROK, the first and last three presidents being elected by the Korean people. The same Korean people must take responsibility for Korea’s current reputation.

    Lee Seung-man (이승만): Embezzled US $20 million, created the conditions for Pak Jung-hee’s military coup, purloined the Liancourt Rocks from Japan.

    Pak Jeong-hee (박정희): Brutal military dictator who was the overseer of the ROK’s economic miracle, never took a bribe but was assassinated in a room salon. The distinction between being bribed with apple boxes of cash and being bribed by apple cheeked young women from Daegu is what?

    Jeon Doo-hwan (전두환): His sons are very wealthy pseudo-yangban.

    Noh Tae-woo (노태우): Seoul Olympics, his sons are also wealthy pseudo-yangban.

    Kim Young-sam (김영삼): His vain attempts to globalise the ROK and make Seoul the financial hub of Asia just like Hong Kong and Singapore failed the first requirement: ensure contracts with foreign companies (especially banks like Lone Star) are enforced according to internationally accepted laws. His son is a wealthy pseudo-yangban.

    Kim Dae-joong (김대중): Was awarded the Nobel Peace Prize for funding Kim Jong-il’s nuclearisation of the Korean Peninsula. His sons are wealthy pseudo-yangban.

    Noh Moo-hyeon (노무현): Presided over the largest capital outflows in the ROK’s history. Funded Kim Jong-il’s missile research and atomic bomb test. His son is a wealthy pseudo-yangban.

    Next Korean president: More of the same.

  32. polysics Says:

    this site is for people who have had bad experiences either with korean americans, korean society, or life in korea. and want to read negative news and information about korea to counter balance this whole korean wave nonsence amd feel better about themselves.everyone knows matt has a chip on his shoulder. this is basicly one big korean bash circle jerk. but the thing that makes this site relavant, is that most if not all the facts posted are researched and true. though if you want more of an intelectual read,about similar subject matter goto the marmit whole or metropolitician. this site is just junkfood for the mind. which is why I keep comming back.

    I could easily start a site about white people, and even though they have done alot of good things. I could just blog about every negative news that hits the press involving whites. and say.. “see? look how fucked up they are”. one could say thats racist. another person can say. well.. that “did” happen… so.. I guess its alright to post it. fact is. people should take blog posts with a grain of salt. if i was korean I dont even think this site would bother me.

    jus sayin’

  33. polysics Says:

    best blog…. evar!!!

  34. Paul89 Says:

    Errol, from 1945 – 1988 south korea was for the most part a dictatorship. It was clearly not perfect. All the president you meantion before 1988 are all corrupt people. every korean kid knows that. You know what yangban are? yangban are the upperclass. In america most presidents also come from such a background. Conspiracy? maybe. But the last two presidents have been elected democratically. members shifting between parties, dont bring up the past that hasnt happened since a very long time.

  35. Sonagi Says:

    Matt,

    I couldn’t find any way to contact you directly through the site, so I’m posting here another photo you might enjoy:

    more flag munchers

  36. tomato Says:

    Sonagi,

    Good photo. These flag eaters are extreme, but they do reflect the stance/belief of the S Koreans about their “history”. Now, their nation-building myth has led them in confrontation with China, not just with Japan. And together with anti-Americanism and the recent conceession between China and Japan, it’s not unreasonable to predict that the Koreans are set for isolation if they go on with these kinds of stuff.

  37. minami562 Says:

    If this weren’t the case, where is the other side defending Korea when public opinion is against it? Such as dog eating or cheating in the world cup 2002?

    Wasn’t there a past post to the effect of “What’s so wrong about eating dog meat?” ?

    As for the 2002 World Cup… There’s not a whole lot you can do to defend Korea. If you don’t want to make Korea look any worse than they do now, don’t go there.

  38. “Stop Stealing Our Culture and Calling it Ancient Korean” » Occidentalism Says:

    [...] Some of you may remember I posted a negative comment from a “Dokdo is Korean land” group on facebook. This time I found another group on facebook, this one demanding that Koreans stop appropriating other countries cultures and labeling it Korean. [...]

  39. Occidentalism » Deal with the problem, not the messenger Says:

    [...] Deal with the problem, not the messenger window.document.getElementById(‘post-480′).parentNode.className += ‘ adhesive_post’;This negative comment reminded me of an episode of South Park where people saw the problem being with individuals that spoke up about the problem, rather than the actual problem itself. It seems to me that a lot of people are angry at Occidentalism (and more lately at Gerry Bevers for his “Dokdo” postings) because it speaks up about things they would prefer to be unspoken. Take a look at the video to see what I mean. [...]