23  Oct
Thanks, Oppa

The other day I met a girl that had just arrived in Sydney. She found shared accommodation in a place with 6 Korean guys and 2 other Korean girls. On her first day in Sydney, the first piece of advice her Korean male flatmates gave her was “don’t date Australian guys” – all 6 of them. Just in case that it might lead to dating, she was also told not to meet Australian guys. The reasons were that Australians were bad, untrustworthy, insincere, treated Korean girls badly etc.

She told me about this but I can’t say I am shocked because every single Korean girl is told exactly the same thing. As far as I know there are no Australians telling people not to date Korean men or giving reasons as to why they should be singled out as uniquely immoral or bad. Yet there seems to be a whole movement in Sydney among Koreans (especially Korean men) that want to racially slander Australians as a somehow morally and ethically inferior people.

As an Australian that can speak Korean, I have long regretted that understanding Korean means that I have to know the degree of contempt that we are held in by Korean immigrants and foreign students (the foreign students don’t matter though because they return to Korea – the immigrants are here forever). If the average Australian were able to understand this kind of thinking, they certainly would not be so enthusiastic about Korean immigration, and certainly would not consider Korean immigrants a ‘model minority’.

Are the morals and ethics of Korean men so good that they look down from their pedestals and pass judgment? I don’t think so. It is hypocrisy, pure and simple. If they could date Australian girls, they would, but they can’t so they have to make sure Korean girls are tightly controlled and corralled. It is the fear of mating competition, and despite protestations, the fact that a great many Australian men are sincere, kind, trustworthy, and would treat Korean girls with respect.

The funny thing is that warning the girls off meeting Australian (“foreigners”) doesn’t even work. It just makes girls want to find out if it is true or not, and the only way they can do that is to interact with Australians.

Update: I was with a friend and three Korean girls this morning in a 24 hour Korean restaurant and when one of the girls went to the toilet she was followed by a Korean guy who intercepted her and told her not to meet foreign guys. When she got back she told the other girls what happened (and by default us too, since my friend and I both speak Korean). I can’t say I was surprised, and neither was my friend, who has experienced similar things many times. One mitigating fact for the ‘oppa’ is that he was obviously very drunk.

Posted by Matt, filed under Racist Industrial Complex. Date: October 23, 2007, 8:53 pm | 313 Comments »

313 Responses

  1. Errol Says:

    Say goodbye to old Korean oppa. Say hello to Chinese oppa. 30 million cashed-up Chinese men will be looking for Korean women soon.

    If we’re running anecdotes … A few weeks ago I was walking down the street and met a Korean girl I know, her Korean girlfriend and two oppa. The oppa brush rudely past me and leave the girls behind with hisses of bballi wa once they’re 10 metres away. I ask my friend, “What’s their problem?” Never seen these blokes before, girl sees me in the distance, says she knows me, these blokes PRETEND they know me and say to my friend, “We know him he doesn’t have (Konglish alert) good manner.”

    OPPA! 30 million Chinese men coming at ya!

  2. Errol Says:

    It’s a mystery that

    Matt says, It is the fear of mating competition …

    because Korean men have a surplus of Australian women in Sydney to (Konglish alert) hunt. Matt the situation is much worse in other Australian cities as the Korean populations are smaller and more tightly controlled by the local versions of Kim Jong-il. It’s all very sad.

  3. T_K Says:

    Pardon my language problem, what does bballi wa mean?

  4. Errol Says:

    It’s an uncouth expression for COME HERE NOW!!!!! Should not be used for seonbae, parents etc etc but suitable for screaming at infants or hissing at infantilised equivalents.

  5. kjeff Says:

    Matt,

    As far as I know there are no Australians telling people not to date Korean men or giving reasons as to why they should be singled out as uniquely immoral or bad.

    Perhaps not, but isn’t this Australian telling people that Korean men, in Australia, are hypocrites?

    The other day I met a girl that had just arrived in Sydney. She found shared accommodation in a place with 6 Korean guys and 2 other Korean girls.

    I’m getting too old… 3 girls living in the same flat with 6 guys? I wonder if this is “typical.”

  6. Errol Says:

    kjeff Says:

    October 23rd, 2007 at 10:53 pm

    3 girls living in the same flat with 6 guys? I wonder if this is “typical.”

    Actually it is. It’s also illegal. Real estate prices have gone through the roof in Australia. One of the oppa is presumably the “official” tenant. By sub-letting to the others he won’t pay any rent at all. On the other hand, the renters just off the plane won’t need to go through a landlord process. Oppas advertise Australian apartments in Korean language websites. As soon as the newbie Korean arrives he/she finds out they could have found a better quality apartment and rented it from an Australian. Yet another reason for honest, old oppa to say …

    (do) not … meet Australian guys

    Especially if they’re au fait with the Sydney real estate market.

  7. GarlicBreath Says:

    the average Australian were able to understand this kind of thinking, they certainly would not be so enthusiastic about Korean immigration, and certainly would not consider Korean immigrants a ‘model minority’.

    Mr Matt,
    .
    coreans act similar in other nations too. Its strange how they abandon corea like rats off a sinking ship, yet once they land on the shores of a new nation, they hold the natives with contempt and bitter hatred.
    .
    I thank you for your honesty in this post. You should be aware that the kyopos that troll this blog will be flaming away.
    .
    I hope that a post like yours will bring greater understaning of coreans.

  8. Errol Says:

    kjeff Says:
    October 23rd, 2007 at 10:53 pm

    Matt,

    As far as I know there are no Australians telling people not to date Korean men or giving reasons as to why they should be singled out as uniquely immoral or bad.

    Perhaps not, but isn’t this Australian telling people that Korean men, in Australia, are hypocrites?

    What Australians want is a “fair go.” An opportunity to present their side of the story. Not to be sneaked on before they can present their case. This right to a “fair go”is also available to Korean males.

    Korean Confucian culture is predicated on the belief that the male seonbae must be obeyed even when he is wrong.

    If a Korean woman in Australia, or any other country, obeys her male seonbae unquestioningly then she is a loyal servant of Korea. From the link, “she said the worst pain came from the whispering gossip of Korean-Americans in New York.”

  9. BananaBoi Says:

    Errol,

    What’s 30 million cashed up Chinese men have to do with this topic? :P

    I think quite a few Australian guys has been cockblocked by Oppas, I know I have!

  10. Errol Says:

    # BananaBoi Says:
    October 24th, 2007 at 1:05 am

    Errol,

    What’s 30 million cashed up Chinese men have to do with this topic?

    Can’t cockblock every bananaboi.:P

  11. alec931 Says:

    Matt: “Are the morals and ethics of Korean men so good that they look down from their pedestals and pass judgment? I don’t think so. It is hypocrisy, pure and simple. If they could date Australian girls, they would, but they can’t so they have to make sure Korean girls are tightly controlled and corralled.”
    .
    I don’t understand this. Are you saying Korean men in Australia are incapable of dating Australian women, or they can’t do it for other reasons? And are you saying if Korean men CAN date Australian women then they ARE somehow morally and ethically superior to pass judgement? If so, I can’t comprehend your logic. Or are you being sarcastic/ironic here?

  12. crypticlife Says:

    I went to law school (in America) with several girls of Korean ancestry. One of them was also a Sunday school teacher for elementary-aged kids — on finding out her betrotheds name was “Charles”, the kids asked, “No, what’s his Korean name?”

    She was obliged then to tell them he wasn’t Korean, and their response was that she’s going to hell.

    I’ve liked most of the Koreans I’ve met, male and female, even though I’ve noticed a tendency towards some clannishness and hypercompetitivity. These particular girls I went to school with were pretty aware of (and somewhat embarrassed about) Korean social tendencies. I believe their parents had grown up in Korea, so the change can be pretty quick.

  13. crypticlife Says:

    I’d like to echo alec931′s confusion. While Asian men are not generally quite as highly sought as Asian women, it’s hardly impossible for them to find dates.

  14. Matt Says:

    I don’t understand this. Are you saying Korean men in Australia are incapable of dating Australian women, or they can’t do it for other reasons?

    The ones that are capable can, and the ones that are not “make sure Korean girls are tightly controlled and corralled”. Some do not want to even if they could for aesthetic or subjective reasons, I suppose.

    And are you saying if Korean men CAN date Australian women then they ARE somehow morally and ethically superior to pass judgement?

    No. That relates to my hypocrisy comment. They would deny to Korean girls what they would not accept being denied to themselves – meaning the right to date whomever they please.

  15. HanComplex Says:

    *sigh* Is this really news? Koreans, especially the males, are some of the most xenophobic people in the world. They seem to have this obsession with blood purity, and would be seething with rage when a non-Korean (white) male gets with a Korean female. “Korean females are the exclusive domain of Korean males” more or less seem to be their line of thinking. They’re almost like Asian Nazis. Last I checked we’re already in the 21st Century.

    This reminds me of the experience of a white guy who lived in Korea as a teenager and had fond memories of the country. When he went back to the US to study, what he encountered was something else.

    Naturally, when I started school in the US, I tried to make Korean friends in the US, both among the students and in the larger community. What I encountered was like a slap in the face. I’d walk into a Korean bookstore to get a dictionary and the people behind the counter would immediately start muttering about “the miguknom” in the store. I’d try to start conversations with Korean shopkeepers, martial arts instructors, etc., and often they would refuse to speak Korean with me, offended (some explained) that I would “consider Koreans too stupid to speak English”, though it was only Korean men who reacted this way. Brand new arrivals (incl. men) seldom acted this way, but it seemed the longer they had been in the US, the more bristling with touchy ego they had become and the nastier they got. Some, however, did a complete flipflop when I explained that it wasn’t that I thought they were too stupid to speak English, it was just that I missed Korea. Then sometimes their egos made me a hero, but that felt a little creepy, too.
    .
    It got worse on campus. Though there the Korean girls didn’t hesitate to talk to me, this seemed to drive Korean guys into spasms of rage. Some Korean guys who later became friends of mine explained that they didn’t blame me. It wasn’t my fault, they explained. It was those *&#@ing Korean girls who were despicable, traitors to the cause, not “acting Korean”. I tried to figure out what this cause of theirs was and, depending on who you asked, it was showing off the greatness of Koreans, destroying the Japanese, restoring the purity and glory of Korea’s past, getting revenge against America for its unforgivable insults against all Koreans, and that sort of fun stuff.
    http://metropolitician.blogs.com/scribblings_of_the_metrop/2007/04/the_politics_of.html#comment-66753128

    What an advanced, refined culture especially in this day and age. Koreans ought to be really proud of themselves.

  16. Brian Says:

    “greatness of Koreans, destroying the Japanese, restoring the purity and glory of Korea’s past, getting revenge against America for its unforgivable insults against all Koreans.”

    Do the trolls on this blog have anything substantial to say? Or is it this garbage all day everyday? Someone fix the record player.

  17. kjeff Says:

    Another complex issue dumbed down to anecdotes and recurring tirades against Korean men. As always, absence is anything substantive…
    .
    HanComplex,
    My usual deflections…Chinese did it too…South-East Asians did too…don’t know enough Japanese…and finally Caucasians did it too, case in point: Harold Ford Jr., look it up!
    I’m curious about the anecdote that you quoted. I went to 4 years of college + 3 years of graduate school in a school that had a large Korean student population, in a city that has one of the largest Korean communities in the U.S., and I rarely(not wanting to say, never) heard anything negative spoken against Japanese/Japan or Americans. I barely spoke Korean at that point, and I gotta say that most were amused, in a good way, that I could, and was speaking in a ‘broken’ Korean. And no, it’s not because I’m half Korean(I witnessed a Caucasian score a free soda by saying ‘Thank You’ in Korean) since I always made a point to introduce myself as an Indonesian. Never heard anything about “blood purity”, never heard of this “unforgivable insults against all Koreans.”
    .
    Anecdote…
    .
    I love anecdotes because they usually give a personal touch to an argument, but you gotta wonder when they themselves are presented AS the arguments. Matt’s one made me wonder, “Hmmm…what sort of girls(it doesn’t have to be Koreans, really, and this is not Real World: Australia) would bunk with 6 men?” Yours…”What kind of hick town did your guy go to college in? No Korean immigrants in medium to large U.S. cities(I can’t imagine any actually) would mutter “miguknom” in the presence the said ‘MiGukNom’”

  18. wiesunja Says:

    This site sums up Korean men to a T. Absolutely brilliant.

    People always say that Koreans make the worst boyfriends. I
    agree. and yes, i am Korean. they also say that chinese boys treat you
    good. hmmm…i’m not knowledgable enough to make a judgement call on
    that, so i’ll just stick with judging koreans.

    Koreans DO make the worst boyfriends. are they all bad? oh no.
    a lot of guys are good. but i would have to agree that on average, korean
    guys are more likely to end up being bad boyfriends. so if you are
    flexible enough to date outside the korean race, your best bet is probably
    with a chinese guy. the good thing is that there are so many chinese
    men in the world, that finding one won’t be a problem. (i always tie in a
    chinese joke.) why are some koreans so bad? here’s why:

    1) MOST KOREANS ARE INSECURE. actually, this is kind of true for people in general, but especially with koreans…they have insecurity issues. i think a lot of it has to do with their size. koreans are usually shorter and skinnier than average. if you missed my other plan about HEIGHT, i mentioned that HEIGHT is the most important physical attribute a guy can have. not that you need height to be attractive or anything, but it helps you more than any other physical trait one might have. their physical setbacks really get into the heads of these young
    men. they feel the need to compensate for their lack of physical attributes and try to always PROVE something. koreans always need to PROVE something. that’s their problem. as insecurity sinks in, they start questioning their self worth, and girls know how attractive THAT is.

    2) INSECURITY LEADS TO PRIDE. Korean guys are probably the most prideful bunch of guys you will ever meet. they are always boasting about
    something. korean guys grow up in families where we are taught to be #1 in this and that…study hard…go to a good school….well respected
    job…make lots of money. that is the ideal life that sons can lead for their parents. this has led to many guys placing their pride in their work
    instead of themselves. their false sense of confidence is actually insecurity masked in acheivement. so a guy can be rich and have
    everything a person could ever want, but deep down inside still doesnt know who he is. he is still lost and when you REALLY get to know him, you realize he has the maturity level of a third grader.

    3) PRIDE LEADS TO ANGER. When pride is broken, anger appears. and many times anger appears in the form of violence. thats why a fight breaks out at asian parties all the time….b/c its a bunch of insecure asians hurting each others pride, which leads to fights. they try to look
    tough and make people think they are strong and honorable, but deep down inside, they have no idea where their lives are going. these guys
    are all potential wife beaters…they will hit you when you get them angry. they will hit you if you hurt their pride. they get jealous, possessive, and irritable. watch out! koreans learn to compensate for their physical setbacks by having ATTITUDE. since they are not big, they learn how to yell. does he get jealous when you talk to his friends? or even guys in general? does he expect you to fit a certain role all the time? does he want you to compromise your goals in order to acheive his? does he view you more as a trophy than a person? if so, then move on even “honorable” koreans place a lot of their pride in acheivements. but take away their job, their money, their car…and if he is still able to stand strong as an individual…he’s a keeper. only real men know to seperate their identity apart from circumstance. insecure boys just run to soju and karoake bars.

    4) KOREANS RUB OFF ON EACH OTHER. mom always told me never to get into a fight with a fob. she says that no matter how much smaller they are than me, i should always back off. why? because when americans fight, they fight until someone is hurt and there is a winner. when koreans fight
    (people straight outta korea), they fight until they kill you. they will literally try to kill you. hit you with bricks and crap. they train in
    taekwondo all their lives…their dad makes them wrestle with dogs in the winter. don’t mess. anyways, pretty much every korean guy has a strong korean influence…meaning that they are influenced strongly by someone who actually grew up in korea. maybe its their dad…or their brother…or cousin. maybe THEY themselves grew up there. anyways, if you look at the typical guy from korea, they are far from romantic. they don’t believe in communication, and they have hot tempers and drink a lot. always watch out for guys who drink a lot. and they grow up thinking it is okay to mistreat women…at least AFTER they have pursued them and gotten married. if you ask most guys what their fathers are like, they will tell you that he is silent, indifferent, and hot tempered. how much of this
    rubs off on others is different from family to family. i’ve been blessed with a wonderful father who defies all stereotypes, but most people grow up with either psychotic fathers or fathers who are non existant in their lives. it sucks.

    so i can understand why korean guys are looked down upon. hot tempered, insecure, abusive, bad communicators, etc. but a lot of korean
    guys are good catches, too. but signs of possessiveness, jealousy, and pride are red flags to move on. there are plenty of fish in the sea.
    don’t settle for a wife beater! go for mike kim, instead. he may be unfaithful to you everyday, but at least he won’t ever hit you. mike says
    “i don’t abuse the ladies physically, just emotionally!”

  19. wiesunja Says:

    Insecure Koreans at it again. No other nationality in the world is so obsessed with trying to “prove” how great their race is by obsessing about eugenic and gene studies as Korea. Koreans are seriously the most f-cked up people on earth.

    http://www.discovervancouver.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=181555&whichpage=1

  20. GarlicBreath Says:

    and I rarely(not wanting to say, never) heard anything negative spoken against Japanese/Japan or Americans.

    At least you admit hearing anti-japanese and anti-american comments. I suspect you would have “heard” even more if:

    1) they trusted you.
    2) you understood corean
    3) You didn’t look at all things Coreans as heaven sent.
    4) you were honest about this topic.

  21. aokiookami Says:

    God, what a bunch of crying losers…

    @wiesunja, being a Korean myself, I don’t particularly find the Chinese/SE Asians attractive nor do I want to be associated with them in any way, but aren’t people in Vietnam and China dark-skinned and short? I thought the Chinese and Viets are like the Mexicans/Blacks of Asia.

    Also, according to the Wikipedia, The Korean guys are the tallest among Asians.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_height

  22. Aude_Sapere Says:

    Actually, because of China’s geographic stretch, it’s impossible to generalize appearances and heights for her people. Northern Chinese, who are more genetically similar to Japanese than their southern counterparts, can obviously be more easily distinguished from them, whose genetic consistency is, needless to say, more closer with SEAsians.

    And again, I know it’s been said, but it is freaking hilarious to see over and over again, how some deflect criticism by bagging on others, and throw into the mix some more self-aggrandizement.

    To kjeff – you make an interesting point regarding anecdotes. Of course, personal testimonies aren’t the greatest, and the judiciary process of the U.S. alone reflects that. However, that doesn’t mean they can’t be discounted. Instead, they need to be considered as well. To me, Matt is plainly making pointed inquiries based on personal experiences and observations, and perhaps too pointed for some. With that said, hence the anecdotes. Your experiences were probably luckier than some, but that doesn’t mean others were just as fortunate.

    Regarding wiesunja’s imported post, I do have to also say that it’s just another anecdote reflecting stereotypes, and a really nasty one at that. I have plenty of Korean friends, and in fact, my very best friend is Korean. But:

    1.) He (my best friend) posits very similar criticisms;

    2.) For those who have problems with anecdotes that only shed a negative light on Korean males, I think the focus shouldn’t be on invalidating them (unless they are indeed incredibly outrageous), but recognize that these people did have the experiences that they had.

    3.) Stereotypes are stereotypes. Everyone is different, definitely. But one’s gotta wonder, just why and how did these stereotypes emerge?

  23. HanComplex Says:

    Brian, I was just quoting someone else’s post.
    Follow the link. Since you don’t agree with it
    it must be garbage or trolling, isn’t it. Great logic.

  24. HanComplex Says:

    wiesunja, thanks for the link. Very interesting article there. Must reading for anyone with even the slightest interest in Korean culture.
    http://dpvball.tripod.com/scottsong/korean_wifebeaters.htm
    There must be something about the way Korean males consider and treat women in their culture. Maybe one shouldn’t be surprised at the violent rash of crimes that’s been happening lately.

    Many Korea women are anxious these days after a series of murders, rapes and other crimes targeting women made headlines recently.
    .
    Last August, two female office workers were abducted and murdered by illegal taxi drivers near Hongik University in Seoul, and in September a police officer raped two women in a subway parking lot late at night, stealing some W19 million (US$1=W917) in cash and valuables.
    .
    Earlier this month, a man in his 30s was arrested for raping nine women who were returning home at night in Seongbuk district in northern Seoul. Women now are increasingly afraid to catch a cab at night or even to go out.
    http://english.chosun.com/w21data/html/news/200710/200710230011.html

  25. Aude_Sapere Says:

    These terrible accounts of these women are also anecdotes.

    I feel kind of bad in saying this, but I’m expecting some, in reaction to the previous post, to introduce similar stories in America/Canada/Japan/China/etc…

    Come on, isn’t it time to recognize that there is a problem, and instead of bashing/invalidating others in reaction, let’s really do the right thing: make things easier for women.

  26. BananaBoi Says:

    I don’t particularly find the Chinese/SE Asians attractive nor do I want to be associated with them in any way, but aren’t people in Vietnam and China dark-skinned and short? I thought the Chinese and Viets are like the Mexicans/Blacks of Asia.

    aokiookami, do you live in a remote area all by yourself or are you just an extremely ignorant person?

  27. kjeff Says:

    Aude_Sapere,

    These terrible accounts of these women are also anecdotes.

    Apples and oranges…
    These “terrible accounts” are anecdotes against public safety and crime prevention which, as the article recognizes, need ‘fixing’. They are not about the men who committed these crimes, unless…well, you know the rest. To me it’s problematic that some here try to lump them together as one. If you were wondering “why and how” stereotypes(usually, the negative ones) begins, well, there’s one for you.

  28. aokiookami Says:

    Actually, I admit that there are some people in Korea, or Japan, who think the Chinese/SE Asians are “incompetent, cheating, lying, backstabbing, smelly and imbecile”, especially since the SARS and avian flu outbreaks in China and other Chinese-influenced Asian countries, but you can’t really whine about some ultra-conservative Koreans being xenophobic…

    For your information, here in Korea, there are more than 260,000 illegal immigrants, mostly Chinese and SE Asians. And the incidences of murder, “rape”, and robbery by these illegal Chinese/SE Asians have increased over the several years.

    안산공단 인근은 외국인 노동자 성범죄 천국

    경기도 안산에 가면 이국적인 외모의 외국인 노동자들을 쉽게 마주칠 수 있다. 이들은 안산시 원곡동 일대의 공단에서 일하는 외국인들. 이곳은 일명 ‘코시안타운’으로 불리며 한국인보다 더 많은 외국인들이 거주하고 있다. 그리고 이들 외국인 중 대다수는 불법체류자들로 구성되어 있다. 문제는 이 외국인들의 한국여성들을 대상으로 한 성범죄가 위험수위에 도달했다는 것. 지난 해 안산지역 불법체류자들에게 성범죄를 당했다는 한국여성의 신고는 무려 1백80여건. 이틀에 한번 꼴로 성범죄가 일어나는 셈이다. 수치심에 신고하지 않고 속앓이만 하는 여성들이 있음을 감안하면 그 수치는 더 늘어날 것으로 예상된다. 상황이 이렇다 보니 안산 원곡동의 밤거리에서는 여성들을 찾아보기 힘들다. 외국인에게 성폭행을 당했다는 흉흉한 소문들과 떼 지어 여성을 물색하는 외국인노동자들이 있어서다.

    국경 없는 마을, 국경 없는 성범죄

    지난 9일 안산 원곡동 시내의 밤거리. ‘국경 없는 마을’이란 별칭답게 구릿빛피부에 뚜렷한 이목구비를 가진 동남아시아계 외국인들로 넘쳐났다. 이들은 삼삼오오 무리지어 낯선 언어로 대화를 나누며 거리를 배회하고 있었다. 이들의 표정에선 남의 나라에 와 있다는 기색은 찾아볼 수 없었다. 이색적인 문자들이 적힌 간판이 붙은 상점들과 외국인노동자들의 외모는 동남아시아의 한 나라에 와 있는 듯한 착각을 불러 일으켰다. 그런데 이 거리에서 이상한 점 하나가 발견됐다. 젊은이들이 한참 활동을 할 저녁 7시인데도 불구하고 거리에서는 젊은 여성들을 찾아보기 힘들다는 것. 그나마 거리에서 마주칠 수 있는 젊은 여성은 한국인이 아닌 외국여성이었다. 이에 대해 원곡동에서 식료품상점을 운영하는 정모(52)씨는 “한국여자가 불법체류자에게 성폭행 당했다는 소문이 계속해서 나면서 해만 떨어지면 여자들이 잘 나오지 않는다”고 말했다. 그 때 술 냄새를 풍기며 왁자지껄 이야기를 나누던 한 무리의 외국인노동자들이 지나가는 여성에게 다가가기 시작했다. 이 노동자들은 어눌한 한국어솜씨로 여성에게 접근해 추파를 던졌다. 이에 그 여성은 소스라치게 놀라며 도망치듯 이들에게서 벗어나는 모습을 보였다.

    이 같은 풍경은 이 거리에서 낯선 모습이 아닌듯 했다. 지나치는 이들도 별일 아니라는 듯 대수롭지 않게 여기는 모습이었다. 원곡동에서 살고 있다는 김모(44)씨는 “괜히 도와준답시고 나섰다가는 험한 꼴 당하기 십상”이라며 “모른 척 하는 게 상책이다”라고 털어놨다. 안산이 이처럼 외국인노동자 천국이 된 것은 지난 1990년대로 거슬러 올라간다. 1980년 이후 안산이 급격히 공단 배후도시로 자리 잡아 가면서 안산 인구의 절반가량이 노동자로 구성이 될 만큼 공단도시로서의 이미지를 확고히 했다. 그러다 1990년 이후 영세 중소기업들이 모인 반월 공단 공장들이 3D업종을 기피하면서 심각한 인력난을 맞아 이를 타계하기 위해 외국인 노동자들을 고용하기 시작했고 현재 전국에서 가장 많은 외국인 노동자들이 거주하는 도시로 변모하게 된 것. 현재 이 지역에 거주하는 안산시민은 4천여명에 불과한 데 비해 외국인들은 무려 2만9천여명에 달하고 있다. 이들 중 중국 국적을 가진 사람이 절반을 차지하고 있고 그 다음 파키스탄과 스리랑카 등 동남아시아계가 다음을 차지한다. 또 이 가운데 2만 여명이 불법체류자인 것으로 알려지고 있다. 이처럼 외국인노동자가 늘면서 외국인관련 범죄도 증가하는 추세다. 경기경찰청에 따르면 경기지역에는 26만3천명의 외국인이 거주하고 있으며 지난해 경찰에 검거된 외국인 범죄자는 3천1백50명으로 2005년에 비해 35.6%나 급증했다. 그중에서도 안산의 경우 성폭행, 성추행 등과 같은 범죄가 빈번히 발생하는 것으로 알려져 있다. 이 지역은 공단의 외국인노동자들에게 ‘강간천국’이라고까지 불린다고 한다. 그만큼 성범죄가 자주 일어나는 것.

    이들 외국인노동자 가운데 성범죄를 저지르는 국가는 파키스탄, 방글라데시 등 주로 동남아시아 출신 노동자들로 알려져 있다. 이들이 한국여성들을 대상으로 한 성범죄를 자주 일으키는 첫 번째 이유는 자국의 금욕적인 종교생활에서 벗어나 보다 자유로운 성문화를 체험(?)하기 위해서라는 분석이다. 일각에서는 여성의 인권이 바닥에 가까운 파키스탄, 방글라데시, 인도 등지에서 온 남성들에게 한국여성 역시 성적노리개로밖에 보이지 않아 성범죄가 자주 일어난다는 분석도 나온다. 두 번째 이유는 외국인노동자 중 불법체류자들이 한국 영주권을 취득하기 위해 한국여성을 골라 성폭행을 저지른다는 것이다. 일단 성폭행을 한 뒤 임신을 하면 결혼에 이를 확률이 높기 때문에 이 점을 이용한다는 것. 항간에는 동남아시아 출신 노동자들 사이에 한국 영주권을 취득하는 방법에 대한 매뉴얼이 떠돌고 있다는 소문도 파다하다. 그리고 그 매뉴얼 안에는 ‘한국 여자를 무조건 임신시켜야 한다’는 내용도 있다고 해 문제의 심각성을 보여주는 대목이다. 불법 체류자들 사이에서는 “한국에 가면 무조건 한국여자를 잡아 애부터 낳아라”라는 말이 유행어처럼 번진 상황이다. 이들은 여성중에서도 약자라고 할 수 있는 정신지체장애 여성이나 미성년자, 이혼녀 등을 타깃으로 삼아 범죄를 저지르는 경우가 많다. 이들 불법체류 노동자들의 성추행, 성폭행 수법은 다양하다. 그 중 하나가 동정심을 유발해 여성을 유혹하는 방식이다. 이들은 타국에 와 인권을 짓밟혀가면서 갖은 고생으로 돈을 번다는 불법체류자들에 대한 고정관념을 이용해 여성들을 유혹한다.

    심지어 자신들을 돕기 위해 교회에서 봉사활동을 나온 여고생을 자신의 집으로 유인해 집단성폭행을 저지른 사건도 발생해 충격을 주고 있다. 또 얼마 전에는 길을 가는 여학생을 유인해 집단 성폭행을 저지른 파키스탄인 3명이 구속된 일도 있었다. 또 할머니와 살고 있는 한 소녀를 외국인 노동자가 납치해 성폭행을 하고 며칠 뒤 다시 납치해 6명의 외국인 노동자가 집단성폭행을 한 사건도 발생해 안산의 거리를 더욱 위험하게 만들고 있다. 이들은 많은 한국 여성들이 성폭행을 당하면 수치심에 신고를 하지 않는다는 점을 이용해 보다 수월하게 성폭행을 저지른다고 한다. 안산에 사는 26세의 한 여성은 외국인에게 성추행을 당하고 우울증에 걸려 병원치료까지 받은 케이스다. 지난해 9월의 어느 날 이 여성은 밤늦은 시각 버스를 탔다. 피곤한 몸을 이끌고 버스를 탄 여성은 자신을 보는 시선을 느꼈다. 자신의 옆 자리에 앉은 두 명의 파키스탄노동자가 자신을 뚫어져라 보고 있었던 것. 약간 기분이 나빠진 이 여성은 곧 시선을 돌려 창밖을 바라보고 있었다. 그런데 갑자기 노동자 중 한명이 옆자리에 앉았고 이 여성의 가슴을 만지며 “아가씨 시간 있어요?”라고 말을 걸어왔다. 너무나 순식간에 일어난 상황에 이 여성은 소리도 지르지 못했다. 곧 정신을 차린 이 여성은 “왜 이러세요?”라고 소리를 질렀지만 이 노동자는 태연히 미소를 지으며 “아가씨도 좋으면서 왜이래? 나 돈도 많이 버는 데 나랑 만날까?”라고 말을 했다. 계속 상대를 하면 자신만 손해라는 생각에 이 여성은 다음 정거장에서 급히 내렸다. 그런데 이 노동자들이 자신을 따라 버스에서 내려 뒤를 밟기 시작했다. 놀란 여성은 가까이 있는 경찰서를 향해 달음질을 쳤고 여성이 어디로 가는지 몰랐던 이 노동자들은 여성을 따라 경찰서 앞까지 따라왔다. 내심 잘됐다고 생각한 이 여성은 경찰서 앞에 있는 경찰들에게 “이 사람에게 성추행 당했다”라고 말을 했다.

    그런데 더 기가 막힌 것은 경찰의 반응이었다고. 경찰은 이 여성의 말은 믿지 않고 “우리랑 잘 놀다가 이 아가씨가 갑자기 여기로 뛰어왔다”는 파키스탄인의 말에만 귀를 기울였던 것. 경찰은 증거가 없으니 그냥 집으로 돌아가라며 여성을 돌려보내기까지 했다. 경찰은 “외국인 노동자들이 약자인데 죽을 각오를 하지 않는 이상 그런 짓을 하겠느냐”는 논리를 내세우며 외국인을 옹호하기까지 했다고 한다. 이 같은 일을 겪은 뒤 여성은 한동안 우울증에 시달렸고 지금도 외국인, 특히 동남아계열의 외국인을 보면 피할 정도로 후유증에 시달리고 있다. 이처럼 ‘외국인 노동자들은 약자이며 한국인에게 당하고 살 것이다’라는 편견은 오히려 한국인에게 화살로 되돌아오기도 한다. 이를 악용해 한국여성들을 쉽게 표적으로 삼아 성범죄를 일으키는 것이다. 외국인 노동자의 인권보호를 외치는 이면에서 한국여성들이 피해를 입고 있는 경우가 발생하고 있다. 이처럼 외국인 노동자들의 성범죄로 안산은 골머리를 앓고 있다. 이에 대응하기 위해 안산 단원경찰서는 총 7명으로 구성된 외사강력범죄 특별수사팀을 편성하는 등의 노력을 기울이고 있다. 그러나 계속해서 증가하는 외국인 노동자들의 범죄를 단속하기엔 인력이 턱없이 부족한 것도 사실이다. 오늘도 안산의 밤거리는 언제 발생할지 모를 성범죄에 노출된 채 두려움에 떨고 있다. 보다 근본적인 대책을 수립할 때다.

    [일요시사 김봄내기자|스포츠서울닷컴제휴사]

    The article above is in Korean, but I am sure that either Matt or Gerry would be able to read the article.

    Also, it is not news that there are a whole lot of Chinese illegals posing as ethnic Koreans, Japanese or other nationalities abroad:
    RCMP arrests a group of Chinese “posing as Koreans” in Canada

    ST. JOHN’S, N.L. (CP) – In the second incident in less than a month, RCMP have arrested a group of Chinese citizens trying to exit a cruise ship with false passports in Atlantic Canada. RCMP said that six people attempted to get off the cruise ship Star Princess in St. John’s on Tuesday using illegal passports. Much like incidents on Sept. 9 and 20 in Halifax, police said the three men and three women were “posing as Korean passengers” aboard the cruise ship.

    Dutch Advised to Watch Out for `Korean Imposters’ – Dutch people will have to learn how to tell Koreans from Chinese. Some Chinese visitors to the Netherlands are reportedly trying to exploit South Korea’s increased post-World Cup recognition by pretending to be Koreans. South Korea and Holland have become closer since Dutch coach Guus Hiddink piloted the Korean national team to the semifinals of the football tournament.

    A growing number of South Koreans are visiting the homeland of their newfound national hero, and are warmly welcomed by the locals. Many Dutch people greet Asian visitors on the streets, shouting “Guus! Guus!” or “Tae~han-min-kuk!” (Republic of Korea). Some pubs and restaurants offer Koreans beer and food on the house. “I felt very proud of being Korean throughout a recent trip to the Netherlands, but I was ashamed of disgraceful behavior by some Chinese tourists,” read an Internet message posted on the homepage of the Chinese Embassy in Seoul, which was immediately erased for unknown reasons.

    “I saw a group of more than 20 Chinese tourists ask loudly and rudely for a 50-percent discount at a restaurant, claiming they were Koreans.” An uncouth Chinese man even harassed a Dutch woman, saying “Hey, I am Korean, tonight together OK?” the message charged. “In general, the Dutch think Koreans are nice and polite. It is feared that such a good image will be tainted by a handful of inconsiderate Chinese tourists,” said Kim Jong-sook, who stayed in Amsterdam for the past half a year.

  29. kjeff Says:

    aokiookami,
    Fighting against stereotypes while forming your own stereotypes against others…that’s just stupid. I wonder if you’re not one of these Korean ‘posers’ you were talking about. Come one , grow up!!! Oh yeah, this is coming from a South-East Asian man who happens to be half-Chinese.

  30. aokiookami Says:

    @Aude_Sapere, the people in NE China are actually not Han Chinese, they are “Machus” who are related to the Mongols, the Koreans and the Japanese in genetic terms.

    The gene differences between N.E. and S.E. Asians (Matsumoto H Department of Legal Medicine, Osaka Medical College, Japan):
    http://i235.photobucket.com/albums/ee33/chingchongman/gene_differences1.gif
    http://i235.photobucket.com/albums/ee33/chingchongman/gene_differences2.gif

    In addition to the genetic differences, there are also significant differences between N.E. and S.E. Asians in terms of “spoken” language: Mongol, Korean and Japanese languages are part of the Ural-Altaic (also Uralo-Altaic) family group which also includes Turkish, Finnish and Hungarian, meanwhile Chinese is part of the Sino-Tibetan family group which also includes Vietnamese, Thai and other S.E Asian languages.

    Hope this helped.

  31. BananaBoi Says:

    aokiookami, We don’t need Matt or Gerry to translate the above post, because this is another typical korean Red Herring tactic being used here. We are sick and tired of koreans trying to derail the MAIN TOPIC being discussed here!! If we want to discuss about any lying, cheating and backstabbing Chinese/Japanese illegal immigrants in Korea, we will do so in an appropriate topic!

    Matt, you should make a rule on your blog to stop this from happening.

  32. aokiookami Says:

    @kjeff, here are some of the reasons why the Chinese are hated everywhere:

    - #1 air polluter and greenhouse gas emitter
    - Organ harvest of prisoners
    - Jailing of human rights activists, Catholic and Muslim priests
    - Killing of Tibetans, East Turkistanis, Mongolians
    - Tainted food and toys
    - Fake and unsafe products
    - Rampant Corruption
    - Blockage of free trade and manipulation of exchange rate
    - Invasion of Tibet, East Turkistan, Mongolia, and Taiwan
    - Covering up AIDS, SARS, and Avian (Bird) Flu
    - Supplying arms for genocide in Darfur and Burma
    - Forced eviction and forced abortion

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_MP9X8b1Uu4
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RdIIlCfI3K8
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CqfyTyMJjf8

    The Chinese communist government has been stirring up anti-American & anti-Japanese (& recent anti-Korean) sentiments in China in an effort to deflect foreign criticism.

    People’s Republic Of Cheats

    Rampant corruption is eating into the vitals of the Chinese economy. But unless Beijing builds robust institutions, the rot will continue

    ———————————————————————–
    By Bruce Gilley/BEIJING

    A LITTLE-NOTICED PROPOSAL raised at the annual meeting of China’s national parliament in March called on the government to step up efforts to build trust in the economy. Widespread fraud, piracy, evasion of debt and taxes and consumer rip-offs had “brought social trust in our economy to the brink of collapse,” wrote delegate Lu Guanqiu, chairman of Hangzhou-based vehicle-parts maker Wanxiang Group and chairman of China’s Rural Enterprises Association.

    The proposal seemed a little esoteric. But for Lu and many other businessmen, the growing lack of trust in China’s economy has already reached crisis levels. “I have been cheated dozens of times, costing our company hundreds of millions of yuan,” says Lu, ticking off instances in which subcontractors have run off with deposits and pirates have copied his products. “Now I’m running all over the country talking about this issue and the reaction has been very good.”

    The high-profile hand-wringing about cheating in all its forms reflects a widespread fear that China’s economy is gradually being suffocated by a wave of dishonesty. Whether it’s tax evasion, counterfeiting, fraud or any number of other acts of deception, businessmen and officials say the phenomenon has reached epic proportions. Half of all business contracts signed in China are fraudulent in some way, officials say, while two-thirds of all state firms cook their books.

    Economists say the problem is already slowing the economy because of the direct economic losses associated with cheating as well as the higher transaction costs it imposes on the economy. Domestic companies and consumers are the big victims. But foreign companies are not immune and this presents a dilemma: Either stay out of the market and miss opportunities, or get in and risk losing money to cheats. Microsoft, for example, admits it is losing money in China despite a dominant position because it is forced to sell its products at low prices to head off piracy.

    Beijing has responded to the complaints with a new campaign–launched in April–against what it calls “economic disorder.” But many analysts say that new institutions are needed–like independent roduction
    watchdogs and anti-corruption bodies–to solve the problem. In the absence of that, business advisers warn foreign companies piling into China in anticipation of the country’s entry into the World Trade Organization to be prepared to deal with pervasive dishonesty.

    “So many weird things happen here. You find a local partner and four months later he’s siphoning off your business to his brother,” says Patrick Norton, a partner with lawyers O’Melveny & Myers in Shanghai. Thorough due diligence, carefully structured contracts and on-site management are common defences for foreign firms, he says. Also important, he says, are cultivating government contacts that can help if a company is being cheated, as well as deep insider industry knowledge “so you know who’s doing what to whom.”

    Consider the extent of cheating in China’s economy, all according to recent officially published figures:

    – 50% of the 4 billion contracts signed in China are fraudulent in some respect.
    – Economic corruption eats up 13%-17% of the country’s annual GDP.
    – Tax evasion accounts for 50% of taxes due in the private economy, while total losses from tax evasion are 100 billion renminbi ($12 billion) a year.
    – Counterfeit goods and substandard goods account for 40% of all products made in China, with losses running at 200 billion renminbi a year.
    – Two-thirds of the biggest state firms produce false accounts.
    – The underground economy is the equivalent of 20% of GDP (actually twice that, say independent estimates).
    – 15%-20% of the spending on an average infrastructure or building project is lost to bribery, fraud, and poor-quality work.

    China’s cabinet makes no bones about the problems. “Markets are flooded with counterfeit and shoddy goods, tax fraud has continued, commercial fraud and debt evasion are becoming increasingly serious and false financial statements are quite common,” it said in launching the crackdown in April. “These problems are shocking. Not only have they had an impact on the healthy operation of the national economy, they have also caused a decline in public morality and undermined the credibility of the country.”

    To some, the widespread nature of cheating in China’s economy is an indictment of Beijing’s handling of the reform process. The dogma has always been economic reform before political reform, but the biggest result has been a lack of institutions to monitor and ensure fairness in the economic sphere. A new index by consultants PricewaterhouseCoopers, for example, measures the problems faced by business in five areas–the bureaucracy, the legal system, economic policies, accounting standards and regulations. China ranked worst out of the 35 countries surveyed with an aggregate score of 87 out of 100. The figures for other Asian countries went from a low of 29 for Singapore to 67 for Thailand.

    Others point to the state’s lack of moral claim on individuals with the collapse of its communist ideology. That means cheating is often seen as a sort of righteous act. Until he was jailed for life last year for a $75 million bank-fraud scheme, China’s most famous entrepreneur, Mou Qizhong, proudly referred to himself as “The Big Cheat.”

    Many also point to the still-fresh impact of the Cultural Revolution, which set friends and families against each other, eating away at the “social capital,” or ability of parties to engage in cooperation based on trust alone, which modern research shows is so critical to a successful market economy. Efforts to rebuild society, meanwhile, are hampered by official restrictions on social organizations not controlled by the state, including independent business associations.

    Beijing’s response to the crisis has been to appeal to morals and to make threats backed up by repeated campaigns. Dozens have been executed for everything from outwitting banks into lending money to selling poisonous rice. The new drive launched in April relies on a Maoist-style “campaign” with promises of “severe punishment” and “severe crackdowns” along with “ideological and moral education.”

    ROOT AND BRANCH
    “No matter what these people have done in the past, what advantages they provided or with whom they are connected, they must be comprehensively and totally investigated and destroyed root and branch without the slightest mercy,” the party’s Seeking Truth magazine said in May. But most say Maoist campaigns are not enough. Rather, Beijing needs to make institutional changes to solve the problem. Accountability, law enforcement and transparency could all be improved by more aggressive and empowered institutions, including state auditors and courts. Loosened restrictions on social groups like the media and business groups, meanwhile, could provide a ground-up support. At present, both are tightly constrained.

    Critics like outspoken economist He Qinglian argue that the problems are not self-correcting and will only worsen in the absence of high-level political change that puts accountability at the top. Only then can society create a business-ethics system that will be self-monitoring, she says. As things stand, you can get away with anything and so most do.

    Lu of Wanxiang agrees. “Political reform will be the principal way of resolving this,” he says. To Lu that means bolstering the powers of commercial and tax inspectors in the face of protective local governments and giving courts more independence. Whether China needs a higher-level political shakeup to attain that remains in debate. But no one disputes that corruption is seriously hampering Asia’s fastest-growing economy.

    “Cheating and scams, smuggling, tax evasion, fake goods and other cases have increased hugely and the amounts involved are becoming large,” says a book published by scholars at the Central Party School this year. “The future dangerous consequences are getting bigger and bigger. It now bears directly on the success or failure of the whole reform effort.”

  33. aokiookami Says:

    And here’s what’s happening in China:
    1) Japanese and Korean gadget, phone and car makers release sleek, innovative new devices or vehicles domestically in Japan and Korea.
    2) Chinese rip-off companies buy one, and return to China where the whole thing is copied.
    3) The Chinese companies sell the fake version domestically in China.
    4) when the original is finally sold in China, Chinese consumers think the original is a counterfeit of a Chinese original, since the Chinese phone was sold first, and are OUTRAGED at the copyright violation. Counterfeiters cost legit companies about $650 billion per year and growing fast, and the overwhelming majority of it happens in China.

    http://english.chosun.com/w21data/html/news/200701/200701150004.html
    http://www.engadget.com/2006/11/24/keepin-it-real-fake-part-xxxvii-china-car-makers-strike-again/
    http://english.chosun.com/w21data/html/news/200611/200611240009.html
    http://english.chosun.com/w21data/html/news/200701/200701160009.htmlI

    Also, here’s a video clip on the “rampant chinese piracy” from the Japanese news: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZSBMc9Z5od8

    Highlights (for those who can’t speak Japanese):
    - A copy of a car tail light: the original says KOREA on it, while the Chinese copy says KOBEA. The other major difference between them is that the Chinese-made light is not properly sealed and can fill up with rain water.
    - Korean consumers tell reporters that it is very difficult for them to tell if brand bags being sold in shops are the real thing.
    - A Chinese company is selling copies of a Korean beer brand. Six months after a South Korean company started selling a new motorbike, a Chinese company suddenly began selling an copy of the vehicle. While the outside appearance is similar, the Chinese-made bike’s engine apparently
    breaks down within its first year of use.
    - A Korean employee of a major golf goods brand states that he is concerned that Chinese/Taiwanese copies are having a negative influence on the image of his brand.

  34. Aude_Sapere Says:

    @aokiookami, actually, the people in the three Northeastern Provinces of China (Heilongjiang, Jilin, and Liaoling are all over 80% Han.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Northeast_China

    Not like it matters, considering the fact that people do assimilate into each other’s ethnic groups. It’s a process that has been going on since the beginning of human history, so I hope that concept hasn’t been lost on you. And gee, the last dynasty of China, capital in Beijing, wasn’t Han Chinese, but Manchurian. Hmm…..you don’t think intermarriages occurred?

    The people in Northeast China are more than likely amalgamations of these ethnic groups, and such a process has been going on for millennia, so it’s pretty far-fetched to say they’re not Han. And obviously, whether or not you deem them to be non-Han, the statistics clearly show that the majority of them identify with being Han Chinese.

    @kjeff, I totally see what you’re saying, and it is unquestionably a good valid point. But while their main focus is on public safety and crime prevention, they do hold weight against those people who deny that they do happen, or those who understate their significance.

  35. Aude_Sapere Says:

    LOL, talk about major digression. What’s the point? It’s just as easy to point out Korean cultural and technological piracy, and contradictions in human rights policies and foreign affairs over the past 3000 years. Nothing is achieved in throwing insults back and forth.

    Is it possible to stick to just the problem at topic? Is it that hard?

  36. Aude_Sapere Says:

    Some people criticize this website so often for pointing out only the negative sides of Korea. To an extent, that may be true.

    But based on my observations of how certain netizens act and behave, I’m more firm in my belief that this website isn’t so much of a self-motivated initiative, but a reaction.

  37. Aude_Sapere Says:

    LOL, somehow, negative statistics of the Chinese GOVERNMENT somehow represents Chinese individuals all over the world. Apparently, people are hated not because of their personalities, but because of their governments.

    A continuation in great exercises in logic: somehow, negative statistics of the Chinese government is able to justify/compensate the malignant behavior of certain Korean men, the original topic of this post by Matt.

  38. Aude_Sapere Says:

    Once again @aokiookami, to give you some credit for the research that you did, yes, I totally admit that China has all these problems, and these problems are certainly issues the Chinese government must tackle.

    Now that I’ve conceded on that point, what now? Did your discourse solve anything?

    Again, I reiterate what I said in my previous posts.

  39. aokiookami Says:

    @BananaBoi, actually, the Koreans look down on the Chinese as much as the Japanese look down on the Chinese due to the “anti-Chinese” education during the Japanese colonial era; one of the most popular stereotype of the Chinese is that “the Chinese are filthy, backwards and self-centered people”.

    And I came across this video of a Chinese illegal immigrant who apparently worked at a fish factory in Busan, southern tip of S. Korea, and is trashing Koreans with his crappy rap song.

    Check this video out: youtube.com/watch?v=6Cxp0mNdyFM

    p.s. North Korea however is a different story; this sino-sponsored communist puppet-state has been under the rule of the chinese communists for nearly half a century; they may not dislike the Chinese as much as the Japanese and Koreans do.

    p.s.2 Funny you lumped the Japanese in with the “lowly Chinese”. The fact is that the Japanese & the Americans are regarded “quite highly” among the young Koreans here in S.Korea. And, no, there are apparently no Japanese illegals here, just 263,000 Chinese/SE Asian illegal immigrants from China or other poorer SE Asian countries (you can easily spot the ‘cheap’ Chinese/SE Asian prostitutes in every corner of Seoul’s red districts. Cheap, real cheap. But you know, the Chinese women are known to be extremely dirty and unhygienic… So…)

  40. Aude_Sapere Says:

    Man! What an incredible hater! But what’s even more amazing yet completely unsurprising (a wild paradox that is) is the fact that the line of conversation has now completely transformed into China/Chinese-bashing.

    Can the righteous turn the tide?

    The funny thing is, I’ve been in Korea for more than a year now, and I barely see/encounter racism towards Chinese or Japanese. And moreover, I’ve had my fair share of Seoul, and I can only say that your accounts of Chinese/SEAsian prostitutes are specious, if not straightout fabricated. Have you even been to Korea? Or are you just another angry jaemi-gyopo?

    But in the end, regarding your views, I do want to say I feel really sorry for the way you feel. The fact that you have to recycle negative statistics and bash other countries as to aggrandize your country not only reveals 1.) your perception that your country does need aggrandizing 2.) your feeling that the only way to do so is through bashing others, which I think, is really pitiful.

  41. aokiookami Says:

    Hmm… It looks like there are no devils left in Hell, they are “all” in China.

    China’s Execution, Inc.

    Wei, who now heads his own foundation in Washington, D.C., stated that the guard told him, “There are almost no exceptions. They first are given anesthesia. Just the same as killing a pig. . . . We use cloth to wrap them up and bring them to the execution ground. No one cares if they are alive or dead.”

    Chinese Eating Infants

    infant corpses and fetuses have become the newest supplements for health and beauty in China. Not only is the placenta considered a beauty remedy, but also aborted fetuses are much sought after delicacies

    A Chinese Coverup

    Government officials tried to coverup the unfolding ecological disaster in Jilin and Harbin. How can we trust China in the global fight against bird flu? The International Harald Tribune reports:

    The government tried for days to keep secret the threat posed to the nearly four million people of this city by a chemical explosion and benzene leak that has made the water supply unusable, Chinese news accounts revealed Friday.

    The reports, including some from the official Xinhua news agency, suggested that officials here and in Jilin Province, where the disaster occurred 380 kilometers, or 235 miles, up the Songhua River, lied or told only part of the story until they had no choice but to admit the truth.

    Chinese woman’s ‘needle ordeal’

    She can consider herself lucky because had she been conceived in these times, her mother would have had an abortion. Chinese doctors have found 26 sewing needles inside the body of Luo Cuifen, a 31-year-old woman. They suspect they were inserted into the woman’s body when she was a newborn by her grandparents because they were upset she was not a boy. Some of the needles entered the vital organs, such as the lungs, liver and kidneys and one even in the woman’s brain was broken into three parts.

    The sinister discovery was made only when Luo went to hospital because of blood presence in her urine. A routine X-ray revealed the horrific truth. Till this age, the woman was in good health. A team made of 23 doctors, including five specialists from the United States and Canada, are making a plan for removing in the most efficient way the needles at the Richland International Hospital in Kunming, the capital of Yunnan province (southern China).

    “Removing the needles would be a long, complicated procedure requiring several operations.” Xu Mei, the chief doctor at the hospital, told the BBC. The first surgery will occur next week and the woman will get rid of seven needles. This first procedure is evaluated at 170,000 yuan ($22,500), but it will be made for free.

    Luo, from rural Songming County, will have to raise by herself funds for the other surgeries. The theory of the disappointed grandparents cannot be proven now, as they died. In many rural areas boys have always been more ‘valuable’ than girls, as they are the ones who carry on the family name. According to the Chinese tradition only a son can do the funerary rites for his parents and ancestors.

    Combined ignorance (read it cultural preferences for boys), modern reproductive technology and one child policy has led to the fact that by 2020 there will be over 37 million extra Chinese men. There are already 18 million more young Chinese men than women. In the past, undesired girls were commonly abandoned; while modern technique allows their abortion. As China grows richer, more Chinese couples afford paying an ultrasound pregnancy check for practicing gendercide. And annually, 2 million more men are born. About 70 million more boys than girls are born in China. In some provinces of southern China, there is a sex ratio at birth of 130 – 135 boys for every 100 girls (!) (these are absolute world records; the normal sex ratio is 103: 100).

    China’s blood still unsafe, needs help – report

    BEIJING (Reuters) – China’s blood supply is still not being properly monitored for HIV/AIDS a decade after a blood-selling scandal, and it needs international help to tackle the problem, a report said on Thursday. The government has tried to clean up the sector after hundreds of thousands of farmers in central Henan province were infected in the 1990s through schemes in which people sold blood to unsanitary, often state-run health clinics. Then-Health Minister Gao Qiang admitted in a speech earlier this summer that China’s blood donation system was far from perfect and safety worries remained.

    “The demand for blood and blood products is growing in China, and supply is short,” said Sara Davis, co-author of the report and director of Asia Catalyst, a New York-based group that helps non-government organisations in Asia. “This creates an economic incentive for hospitals to rely on illegal, untested blood donations, and that fuels the spread of AIDS,” she added in a separate statement.

  42. BananaBoi Says:

    HAHAHA! Aokiookami, I guess you didn’t understand a word I said did you? Anyway, it was a blast reading your posts about the Chinese/Chinese Government.

  43. Aude_Sapere Says:

    Funny how none of my points are being replied to, except with more negative news posts that had nothing to do with the original topic.

    Matt, we need your moderator power now!

  44. Aude_Sapere Says:

    Keep up the good work Matt, that’s all I gotta say for now.

  45. Aude_Sapere Says:

    Actually, just one more thing to say, now the original line of discussion has completely dissipated.

    I actually hope Korean netizen arrogance and aggression keeps up, and keep up at the point where it is now. Actually, the worse, the better. It only helps strength the position of us moderates, and also, I’m in the opinion that it helps building a better relationship between Chinese and Japanese netizens, and subsequently Chinese and Japanese people, both subjects of tremendous Korean netizen hate.

  46. Aude_Sapere Says:

    Alright, I’ll be fair, not everyone Korean netizen. But a lot of them that’s for sure.

  47. Matt Says:

    Matt, we need your moderator power now!

    Someone call?

    aokiookami, brother, I know there are a million things wrong in the country with more than a billion people, but is it relevant to the topic at hand? If you want to talk about China, at least make it relevant to the topic – human rights issues in China are not.

  48. General Tiger Says:

    Seems like the replies went off topic.
    .
    On the OP: considering my extreme discomfort with idiots who ostratize themselves in their new country, I agree with Matt.

  49. GarlicBreath Says:

    @BananaBoi, actually, the Koreans look down on the Chinese as much as the Japanese look down on the Chinese

    This is a classic tu quoque arguement. Instead of discussing how to fix the problem of corean arrogance and xenophobia, aokio says Japan too japan too.. unfortunatly, many coreans use this type of reasoning, and never seek to adress the real issues. One only needs to look at comments from kyops (or wanna be kyopos) on this blog or other corean blogs by non-corans.
    .

  50. wiesunja Says:

    Aude_Sapere,

    Your post above is so awesome I want to frame it. You have basically summed up everything about Koreans and KA’s perfectly. However, I would change your use of the word “certain” to “almost all”.

    Some people criticize this website so often for pointing out only the negative sides of Korea. To an extent, that may be true.

    But based on my observations of how certain almost all netizens act and behave, I’m more firm in my belief that this website isn’t so much of a self-motivated initiative, but a reaction.

  51. Aude_Sapere Says:

    To wiesunja: thanks man, I appreciate it =)

    I honestly just wish these netizens will start recognizing the issues that are being raised, focus just on them, and peacefully try to resolve them in a civilized manner. Deflecting the problem by saying other countries have similar problems doesn’t solve anything. It doesn’t help at all.

    And I honestly feel kind of inane in saying so, because it’s so needless to say.

    Though I’m becoming more and more convinced that the worse they bash others, the better. I reiterate comment 45.)

  52. ponta. Says:

    aokiookami Says:
    October 24th, 2007 at 7:17 pm

    God, what a bunch of crying losers…

    @wiesunja, being a Korean myself,

    Why the hell Korean people want to be disguised as a Japanese?

    Aokiookami=蒼き狼

  53. kjeff Says:

    Aude_Sapere,

    I honestly just wish these netizens will start recognizing the issues that are being raised, focus just on them, and peacefully try to resolve them in a civilized manner. Deflecting the problem by saying other countries have similar problems doesn’t solve anything. It doesn’t help at all.

    On the other hand, targeting a specific group and refusing to examine it in a larger context certainly “doesn’t help.”
    First, let me say that we all have stereotypes about any groups, be it positive or negative. To use yourself as an example, have you had any experience with ‘all’ Korean netizens? Most? Many(hundreds are ‘many’, but just ‘a few’ of thousands)? To dabble in psycho babble, it comforts us to ‘group and identify,’ it makes our world a whole lot easier.
    Second, the original issue was Korean men’s negative(and wrong; is there a ‘right’ stereotype?) stereotypes against white Australian men. The rapes and murders were irrelevant because crimes are two element occurrences, motive and opportunity, and the stats are reflection of how well ‘law and order’(always wanted to use these words) limits opportunities to commit crime.
    Third, beyond the anecdotes, the issue here is interracial relationship, and how it’s perceived.
    1. As said earlier, this is not uniquely Korean men’s problem. I’ve read several articles(a few years back, and I wish I could link them), and all of them discussed the problem in a larger Asian-Americans(how relevant this is in Australia, I don’t know) context, and not specific to Korean men.
    2. The issue is complex… these stereotypes exist even within the group. I heard of parents against their daughter marrying a man from a certain province in Korea(ChollaDo I think?). Again, not uniquely Korean… my cousin’s fiance, a Chinese Indonesian, initially introduced himself as ‘from’ Jakarta even though he spent first fifteen years of his life in Batak because he’s afraid of the usual Chinese-Batak stereotypes.
    3. How do those come about? Ironically, anecdotes are probably most responsible, aside from pop culture obviously(remember Miss Saigon). “Hypocrisy”, if there’s any, involves very little here. Anecdotes of ‘white’ men dumping their Asian girlfriends after ‘using’ them, i.e. you’re either a notch or a fetish fantasy.
    4. Why do those come about? Well, Matt is right about the “mating competition” thing, although it’s really not that simple.
    Limited Market: immigration. Huh? What? What’s that gotta with anything? Again, I’m not familiar with Australia, but in the U.S, immigration law(I wish I remember which one) favor men. And, it causes a shortage of Asian women.
    Increased Competition: masculinity and femininity. My favorite analogy: When men go to a ‘formal’ event, it means one thing and one thing only, suits and tie, but women… How often do you hear, “A tall, …, …, man” On the other hand, men rarely have any strict ideas of their ideal women. OK, before you say ‘pretty’, that means a hundred things to a hundred people, and there’s only one way to be “tall.” As a 5’9(not quite) man, I’d do OK(kind of average I guess) in Asia, but in the U.S., or Australia?
    Branding: What do they(the non-Asians) think of an Asian male? Well… Isn’t he Bruce Lee’s son, Jackie Chan’s nephew, and Jet Li’s brother? Isn’t he that sociopath, ten thousand concubines wife-beater from “Joy Luck Club?” No, he’s that guy…I wish I can be as skinny as him. No…no…no…shlimp flied lice and kungpao chicken, please.
    .
    Come on…they can handle a little “Australians were bad, untrustworthy, insincere, treated Korean girls badly etc” competition, no?

  54. Aude_Sapere Says:

    To kjeff,

    You are making a lot of good points, and I definitely agree that “targeting a specific group and refusing to examine it in a larger context” doesn’t help.

    However, I don’t completely quite catch your drift.

    Actually, while I did take interest at the anecdote that Matt posted, my involvement in this discussion thread started when I began to notice that for some strange reason, Chinese people were being bashed on; subsequently, I wanted to make a remark on how that (as in the bashing of others by Korean netizens whenever they are criticized) seemed to always happen whenever Koreans are being criticized in such a thread.

    And so, I’m not so sure what you mean by targeting “specific group”: by “specific group,” are you referring to Korean males or Korean netizens? Because I haven’t really touched on the Korean male cockblocking issue raised in the original post yet; again, I was commenting more on thread digression/sideway bash by certain Korean netizens.

    And after all, I did make an amendment comment on how not all Korean netizens are the same. Anyway, cheers mate.

  55. Aude_Sapere Says:

    I think I was rather repetitive in that previous post. My bad.

  56. Aude_Sapere Says:

    And it’s so obvious the inferiority complex is at work again.

    If anything, real China/Chinese haters should hit up sites like Sinosplice to vent their hate, make their voice clear and shiet. Why here? There’s a reason…

  57. Aude_Sapere Says:

    And I’ll state the needless-to-say again, to be extra clear: many Koreans/Korean netizens do not have this inferiority complex, but many others do, evidently.

  58. kjeff Says:

    Aude_Sapere,

    However, I don’t completely quite catch your drift.

    I guess I was being too liberal(or, is it the opposite?) in reading your comment below…

    I honestly just wish these netizens will start recognizing the issues that are being raised, focus just on them, and peacefully try to resolve them in a civilized manner. Deflecting the problem by saying other countries have similar problems doesn’t solve anything. It doesn’t help at all.

    I thought you were referring to netizens like me…my comment earlier,

    My usual deflections…Chinese did it too…South-East Asians did too…don’t know enough Japanese…and finally Caucasians did it too, case in point: Harold Ford Jr., look it up!

    I hope you were not referring to netizens like aokiookami because there’s nothing “similar” in whatever he/she wrote to the issue at hand.
    .
    I wonder if anyone can provide any evidence that aokiokami is indeed Korean or of Korean ancestry. For all I know he can be….sshhhh…Japanese. Oh yeah, you really can’t think of any reasons why a Japanese wants to pretend to be Korean….
    .

    Because I haven’t really touched on the Korean male cockblocking issue raised in the original post yet…

    I’m curious… Personally, I find it terribly ironic that Matt is whining(for reasons stated earlier) about the negative stereotypes -of white Australians- Korean males are spreading to their female counterpart, whilst at the same time, doing exactly the same.

    Yet there seems to be a whole movement in Sydney among Koreans (especially Korean men) that want to racially slander Australians as a somehow morally and ethically inferior people.

    Pleaseee…
    I wonder how many Korean men or women he knows in Sydney. Dozens? Hundreds? And, are they truly representative of what he generalized as “Korean men”? Another of my favorite analogy: Just because you get 8 heads(in a coin toss) in a row, doesn’t mean that it’s not 50-50. I don’t know, maybe he’s not lucky. Maybe, I am lucky. But maybe, he’s ‘hanging’ with the wrong(non-typical) sort of crowd. Again(no judgment, since I’m not privy with the details), a girl living in the same apartment with 6 men(and 2 girls) is hardly typical, even in the liberal country of the N.E. states where I live; unless, they’re all her biological brothers.

  59. General Tiger Says:

    Aude_Sapere, here’s an advice: try writing everything in one post.

  60. Matt Says:

    I’m curious… Personally, I find it terribly ironic that Matt is whining(for reasons stated earlier) about the negative stereotypes -of white Australians- Korean males are spreading to their female counterpart, whilst at the same time, doing exactly the same.

    Over the years, probably thousands, mate. Oh, what exact “negative stereotype” am I spreading about Korean men?

    Again(no judgment, since I’m not privy with the details), a girl living in the same apartment with 6 men(and 2 girls) is hardly typical, even in the liberal country of the N.E. states where I live; unless, they’re all her biological brothers.

    It’s common in Sydney among Korean students and working holiday makers, as many people will attest. If the is a moral problem with it, take it up with your racial bretheren, or hit up http://www.hojunara.com (a site for Koreans in Australia) and see all the ads for mixed accomodation, then you can hit up their BBS to lecture them on correct morals.

  61. HanComplex Says:

    I honestly just wish these netizens will start recognizing the issues that are being raised, focus just on them, and peacefully try to resolve them in a civilized manner. Deflecting the problem by saying other countries have similar problems doesn’t solve anything. It doesn’t help at all.

    I think that’s pretty much the bottom line at the end of the day. The problem with Koreans is that they’re so obsessed with saving face that they don’t want anything negative about their culture brought up, much less discussed, by non-Koreans. It would seem to infer to them that their culture is less than superior or perfect than they believe or portray it to be. So the usual knee-jerk response is to deflect from the issue using tu quoque argumentation. Aokiookami just shown us several good examples of those.
    .
    Of course, Koreans can continue to think this way and keep deflecting and avoid discussing the problems with Korea and Koreans. It must be a fantasy on their part to think that by doing so, the world will never find out what’s rotten about Korean culture. Well, there’s a lot, and denying or hiding it doesn’t do them any good–just the opposite. You’d think they’d be smart enough to figure that out by now. Oh, well.

  62. General Tiger Says:

    HanComplex :
    Talking about all Koreans?

  63. kjeff Says:

    Matt,

    Oh, what exact “negative stereotype” am I spreading about Korean men?

    I’ll let you do the talking…the streotype(perception),

    Yet there seems to be a whole movement in Sydney among Koreans (especially Korean men) that want to racially slander Australians as a somehow morally and ethically inferior people.

    the negative(consequence),

    As an Australian that can speak Korean, I have long regretted that understanding Korean means that I have to know the degree of contempt that we are held in by Korean immigrants and foreign students (the foreign students don’t matter though because they return to Korea – the immigrants are here forever). If the average Australian were able to understand this kind of thinking, they certainly would not be so enthusiastic about Korean immigration…

    Over the years, probably thousands, mate.

    We, my wife and I, don’t meet new people much, but I guess…if we meet 2 new Koreans a week, it’ll only take us two decades to catch up with your “thousands”.

    It’s common in Sydney among Korean students and working holiday makers, as many people will attest.

    Common? As, it’s not unheard of? Or, ‘common’ common? Well, I guess I’m old.
    .
    HanComplex,

    Aokiookami just shown us several good examples of those.

    Convenient, isn’t it?

  64. Matt Says:

    Kjeff, I do not understand. My perceptions, born of my real life experiences, have nothing to do with stereotypes. What stereotype am I spreading about Korean men?

    As for how common mixed accomodation is among Koreans in Sydney, I provided you with a link so you can check for yourself. If there is a problem with it, take it up with your racial brethren.

  65. kjeff Says:

    Matt,
    From wiki,

    Stereotypes are generalizations about groups and individual members thereof, based primarily on membership in that group… , and may be used to justify certain discriminatory behaviors.

    Yet there seems to be a whole movement in Sydney among Koreans (especially Korean men) that want to racially slander Australians as a somehow morally and ethically inferior people.

    “Whole movement,” “Koreans,” “Korean men,” generalization? Is ‘slanderer’ a word? And, oooohhh, “racial” slanderer…

    …they certainly would not be so enthusiastic about Korean immigration…

    “…,and may be used to justify certain discriminatory behaviors,” don’t you like it when things fit?

  66. familyguyy Says:

    Matt I support this wholeheartedly, there is a huge prevalence of Korean share accommodation going on in Sydney at the moment, 99% the Oppa is the “owner” and has up to 10 people in some instances living in these places, moreover sometimes they will have multiple leases on different apartments furnishing these and then filling them with Korean students both men, women and unmarried couples.

    These houses always consist of Korean males living in the lounge rooms (up to 3-4) while the rooms are inhabited by the girls, filled with bunk beds. I have lived in these types of share situations with Korean men over the past 4 to 5 years and I can tell you that Korean men and women sharing is rampant in Australia.

  67. Matt Says:

    Kjeff, a stereotype has to be shared by other people, while Australians don’t know enough about Koreans to have developed any clear stereotypes about them. Non-white immigration to Australia is a recent phenomenon, and Korean immigration more recent still.

    How is my perception a stereotype? According to your standard, any observation is a stereotype, lol.

  68. kjeff Says:

    Matt,

    Kjeff, a stereotype has to be shared by other people…

    I don’t think so; it has to start somewhere. The key point here, you’ve made a generalized observation of the entire group based on the “thousands” of its member you’ve encountered throughout the years. Unless…well, you haven’t met all of them, have you? If you’re uncomfortable with the word, how about if I just say, Matt is spreading a negative generalization of Korean men… is that OK?

  69. Matt Says:

    I don’t think so; it has to start somewhere. The key point here, you’ve made a generalized observation of the entire group based on the “thousands” of its member you’ve encountered throughout the years. Unless…well, you haven’t met all of them, have you? If you’re uncomfortable with the word, how about if I just say, Matt is spreading a negative generalization of Korean men… is that OK?

    Somehow I don’t think that I have the kind of influence that can create a stereotype.

    As for me spreading “a negative generalization of Korean men”, I am not. I am telling of my observations from my real life contact with Koreans. Arguing against racial slander is not spreading negative generalizations or stereotypes, particularly when it is strongly grounded in reality. Also it is not just Korean men – it is Koreans, but especially Korean men.

    So what are you saying kjeff – is it that you have never noticed Korean men have this tendency? I think it is quite well known among people that know Koreans, from first hand experience, not stereotypes, or rumors.

  70. familyguyy Says:

    Kjeff,
    I don’t actually think that Matt is spreading a generalisation at all, he has expressed his opinion giving a specific example of his Korean friend being told by OPPAS not to date Aussie men. Where is the line drawn?

    Not all Korean men think like this but I will guarantee the majority do, and I have heard this time and time again from Korean men themselves. I have also dated Korean girls in the past and been told quite simply that there OPPAS and brothers will not approve of it. Now this a view supported by both the person experiencing it and the person purveying it, I don’t believe this is a stereotype at all I really do think this a widely held view by Korean men not to let there women date outside there culture. I think Matt’s anger stems from the fact this is being done by them in a country foreign to there own….am I correct here Matt?

  71. Matt Says:

    I think Matt’s anger stems from the fact this is being done by them in a country foreign to there own….am I correct here Matt?

    Mainly, although if they allow foreigners in to their country they should allow them the same social rights enjoyed by everyone else. If they don’t want foreigners banging Korean women in Korea they could always restrict the number of foreigners coming in.

  72. kjeff Says:

    Matt,
    Let’s just agree that it is your observations of the Koreans that YOU met. Nothing more, nothing less. Over the years, I’ve known, I guess, hundreds(not “thousands”) of Korean men, and I don’t much remember hearing similar stereotypes said of white Americans. Of those I heard, they’re usually came from parents worrying about their girls(still refusing to believe that Korean-Korean couples do have sex before marriage).
    .
    Maybe it’s because those I met tend to be older, mid 30s and above, or that I’ve mostly been living in the Northeast, the capital of political correctness; most of them are also long time residents that they don’t dwell in stereotyping, not out loud at least.
    The Koreans that I met when I visited Korea are usually my wife’s crowd. She’s in academic, and I don’t think they’d risk sounding stupid by making wide generalizations.
    Maybe my experience is not typical…maybe yours is not…maybe is somewhere down the middle…who knows.
    One question though, do you think that these stereotypes are uniquely Korean? And before you write, “I don’t care” or “Well, we’re talking about Koreans,” take your best shot.

  73. Errol Says:

    It’s anecdote season! It’s Japan season! It’s China season! It’s control freakery oppa season!

    A few years ago I’m waiting in my Canadian female friend’s apartment for our mutual friends. The topic of control freakery Korean males enters the conversation. She: “I had a Korean boyfriend once”.
    Me: [Nonchalantly] Really? What was it like?
    She: In the beginning it was OK and then …
    Me: And then … ?
    She: He started to control everything I did … How I sat … I ate … What clothes I wore … I just couldn’t take it anymore. We broke up.
    Me: Hmmm.
    She: He even told me not to talk to western men anymore.
    Me: [Raises eyebrows in Mr kjeff-stylee disbelief of such stereotypical behaviour].
    She: I could never give up my friends.
    Me: [Shrugs shoulders. Smiles]
    She: 눈물 흘리나

  74. empraptor Says:

    I got to the part where two commenters started going back and forth, one of them trashing China or its people for some reason or another. At which point I got bored and stopped reading.

    Not being a girl, I don’t know if Korean girls are being told this. But I certainly haven’t told girls stuff like this myself. Who they date is their business. And population of any nation is large enough that you’ll find many exceptions for any stereotype you try to apply to them. In this way the Korean guys who tell girls Australians make bad boyfriends are wrong, regardless of the average satisfaction one may derive from dating random selection of Australians. I would hope most people do not randomly select people they date.

  75. T_K Says:

    Mainly, although if they allow foreigners in to their country they should allow them the same social rights enjoyed by everyone else. If they don’t want foreigners banging Korean women in Korea they could always restrict the number of foreigners coming in.

    …or be forthcoming and restrict interracial affairs de jure. Now that’s headline material!

  76. Errol Says:

    T_K Says:
    October 26th, 2007 at 1:06 am

    … restrict interracial affairs de jure.

    Korean version of de jure. Consider the wise words of Mr Careb at the Marmot’s Hole.The part referring to the “He hit my girlfriend”. Control freakery generally refers to behind-the-scenes attacks on the Korean female partner when she is not with her western friends.

    15. Careb your flag
    Posted July 19, 2007 at 12:52 am | Permalink

    I always try to provide a little legal perspective to these kinds of things. Attention American soldiers, English teachers, and businesspersons: “He was looking at me” is not recognized as a reason to use violence under Korean law. You’re welcome.

    i would also like to add that neither is:
    “He hit my friend”
    “He hit my girlfriend”
    “He threw a beer bottle at me”
    “He pushed me”
    “He took a swing at me”
    “He came at me with a knife”
    “He jumped me with his buddies”

    a few key points:
    1) if you are in an altercation with a Korean, you will get arrested.
    2) you can usually avoid jail and fines if you are way more fracked up than the Korean
    3) if the Korean involved is more messed up, you will get the short end of the stick and if you are an E2 holder that will likely include deportation
    4) if you have been really, really visibly tooled and the Korean is unmarked (the police don’t really count scratches and bite marks), then he will get a big WTF? lecture from the cops
    5) you will never ever be compensated for any injuries as suing the jerk will probably mean losing your job (mostly for the E2s) and most Korean strangers you meet will be completely apathetic to your plight and some will even seem disappointed that you weren’t hurt more
    6) the best thing to do is walk away regardless of the situation, your feelings, level of insult, etc.

    [these valuable life lessons come from 1st hand experience, watching friends suffer, and reading about other expats in similar predicaments]

    Once again thanks Oppa.

  77. GarlicBreath Says:

    kjeff Says:

    Matt,
    Let’s just agree that it is your observations of the Koreans that YOU met. Nothing more, nothing less

    And when did Mr Matt claim otherwise?

    Over the years, I’ve known, I guess, hundreds(not “thousands”) of Korean men, and I don’t much remember hearing similar stereotypes said of white Americans.

    Ineresting, that you use “white” americans, trying to narrow things a bit are we? What do they say about black americans? Thought so… I should also note that your comments are YOUR observations nothing more and nothing less.
    .
    However you do admit…

    Of those I heard, they’re usually came from parents worrying about their girls(still refusing to believe that Korean-Korean couples do have sex before marriage).

    so, you admit that coreans do talk badly about americans. When they said that, did you correct their spreading a negative generalization of American men? No.. didn’t think so. pathetic.
    .
    No wonder Mr Bevers thinks you are not honest. Neither do I.
    .
    If Corean parents are telling their daughters to stay away from so called “evil” American, why is it such a strech that young corean men, afraid of competion, would say just as bad of things. Or worse things.
    .
    Any White, Black, SE Asian men ect (non corean) that spends a bit of time aound coreans will generally tell you that corean men (not all) are cock blocking assholes. Anybody who has spent some time in corea will have seen a few stinking drunk soju swilling corean men beating women, girlfriends, wives.. That is why corean men have a reputation as wifebeaters.

  78. HanComplex Says:

    So what are you saying kjeff – is it that you have never noticed Korean men have this tendency? I think it is quite well known among people that know Koreans, from first hand experience, not stereotypes, or rumors

    I think for some people, they don’t consider it to happen or occur if they don’t experience it first-hand or at least frequently enough. People with blinders or with rose-tinted lenses rarely, if ever, see what they refuse to see.
    .
    To be fair, the xenophobia of Koreans especially when it concerns a Korean female with a non-Korean doesn’t only extend to when they live overseas. They’re just as comfortable practicing it at home.

    Cho Doo-ri was eating dinner recently with his family when their waitress asked his wife a question.
    .
    “Why is a beautiful girl like you married to a foreign man instead of a Korean man?” she said, in front of their 3-year-old daughter, at a seafood restaurant in Wolmido, Incheon.
    .
    Cho, 39, is a migrant worker from Bangladesh who became a Korean citizen two years ago. The family quickly left the restaurant, barely finishing their noodles.
    .
    They walked outside. A middle-aged man spotted the couple. He said to Cho’s wife, “What’s wrong with your eyes? Why did you marry a ―,” using an obscene Korean word that refers to a person with dark skin.
    .
    “My wife talked back to him, saying ‘It is none of your business,’ ” Cho said in fluent Korean. “And they had a verbal fight while passersby watched. She cried a lot when she came back home.”
    .
    He said such abuse is common for him, even as the number of foreigners continues to rise in Korea.
    http://joongangdaily.joins.com/article/view.asp?aid=2880037

  79. aokiookami Says:

    @GarlicBreath, Actually, Korea is now considered to be among the most advanced socities when it comes to “gender equality and women’s rights”, even compared to the western countries:

    “The World Women’s Forum 2007″ held in Seoul, Korea

    The World Women’s Forum, hosted by MBC (Munwha Broadcasting Corporation) with support of the Ministry of Gender Equality & Family, is an integral element in the broadcaster’s yearlong campaign, “Woman Power-The Future of Korea,” which has included a wide range of programs and campaigns aimed at empowering women in Korea and abroad.

    Over the past several years, we have seen the status of women in Korean society make astonishing progress. Korea has for the first time in its history a female Prime Minister, while vigorous efforts to adopt comprehensive plans for the advancement of women have received positive feedback from the international community.

    But compared to Korea and Japan (the two most advanced Asian democracies), there are still third-world Asian socities, such like as SE Asia, the middle east and China, where women are horribly abused (i.e. bride trafficking, family violences, and flooding Chinese/SE Asian prostitutes sold by their husbands), forced to engage in very demanding agricultural work and etc…

    Tens of thousands of women are bought and sold in China each year. The most popular areas for abducting women are the poor areas of Yunnan, Sichuan and Guizhou. (Human Rights in China organization report, Sophia Woodman, Stephanie Ho, “Trafficking of Women in China,” Voice of America)

    Traffickers are increasingly transporting Burmese and Chinese girls for prostitution, partially due to a decrease in the availability of northern Thai girls.

    Girls from China, aged 12-18, are in more demand for the sex industry in Thailand since fewer girls from Northern Thailand are being lured by traffickers. (Wanchai Boonphacra, Centre for the Protection of Children’s Rights, “More foreign workers join sex industry as fewer Thai girls enter flesh trade,” Poona Antaseeda. Bangkok Post)

    Thousands of girls from China’s southern are trafficked into Thailand’s sex industry; some go on to Malaysia or Singapore. The economic crisis has no impact on this segment of the sex industry. More affluent Chinese businessmen from mainland China or Taiwan who do business in Thailand purchase sex from these Chinese girls. (Supalak Ganjanakhundee, “Migrant workers booming as Asian economy declines,” Kyodo News)

    3,000 women and children were rescued after being abducted and sold into slavery in Southern China during the past two years. Local authorities do not assist the victims because they have sympathy for men who cannot find wives. It is cheaper to buy a woman than to have a proper wedding. In one incident in Uangdong, a whole village purchased women and prostituted them from their homes. One household had bought close to 100 women and was selling them in prostitution. (Sophia Woodman, Stephanie Ho, “Trafficking of Women in China,” Voice of America)

    A trafficker was arrested and confessed to having abducted 1,800 women from Beijing. Because of opposition from the villagers and from local officials, police were only able to rescue six women out of 1,800. (Stephanie Ho, “Trafficking of Women in China,” Voice of America)

    A 12-year-old girl from the Zheijang region was sold for US$40,000 to a trafficker. She was taken to Bangkok, Thailand for “instruction” in prostitution. Authorities found the girl in Italy. Her destination was the sex industry in Miami, Florida, USA. (“Pedophilia ring uncovered in Italy,” USA Today)

    The pre-revolutionary custom of bride selling has returned to rural villages in China. Marriage brokers – essentially slave dealers – search the countryside, offering girls for sale to prospective husbands. The recruiters kidnap and buy women and girls. From 1991 through 1996, Chinese police freed 88,000 kidnapped women and children and arrested 143,000 people for participating in the slave trade. Women often work with a marriage broker in the hope of saving their families from hunger. “Local people defend the man who buys a wife, they think if she takes money and sends it to her parents, he should be able to marry her.” (Liu Bohonhg Beijing social worker, Dorinda Elliott, “Trying to Stand on Two Feet”, Newsweek)

    The kidnapping of women for marriage by criminal gangs and middlemen has become a growth industry in China. (CATW – Asia Pacific)

    In China thousands of young women are being kidnapped and sold as wives to lonely men. Buying an abducted wife is an ancient Chinese practice abolished by the communists – but now it’s back with a vengeance.

    Sources:
    http://www.insightnewstv.com/d08/
    http://www.uri.edu/artsci/wms/hughes/china.htm

    I have plenty more, but you get the point.

  80. Errol Says:

    aokiookami Says:
    October 26th, 2007 at 5:08 am

    … you get the point.

    Your point being that control freakery extends to dissing the the many wonderful Chinese men in the world?

    Let’s get this stereotyping statistics sorted.

    The t distribution approximates the normal distribution with random sample sizes of 30 or more, given the usual caveats of biased sampling, strata sampling etc. etc.

    Then if, as has been attested by multiple posters on this board, that no or very few Korean males can resist control freakery then the characteristics of the Korean male sample may be attributed to the Korean male population.

    Your egregious attacks on the males of China smacks of control freakery. China’s rising sons of the west need wives. 8 years ago Korea and China’s GDP was the same. China’s GDP is now double that of Korea’s GDP. In 8 year’s time (at current growth rates) it will be four times larger than Korea’s GDP.

    There will be a lot of cashed up Chinese blokes … get used to it.

  81. aokiookami Says:

    @HanComplex, Hmmm.. No right-minded parents would want their daughter to marry an “illegal” immigrant from the poorer countries like Bangladesh, China or other third-worlds and live her life miserably. Actually, it’s not xenophobia but rather a desire to preserve and “further” improve the “quality of life” the people of S. Korea already enjoy…

    Anyway, though off-topic, here’s an interesting article from the Asahi Shimbun:
    Asia: Taiwan-based telephone fraud groups spreading overseas

    BY YOSHIHIRO MAKINO

    THE ASAHI SHIMBUN

    SEOUL–The automated voice on the other end of the line in May informed the man that there was a query about his account at a leading South Korean bank.

    “As for your credit card that we issued, you have been in arrears with the repayment of 2 million won (about 250,000 yen). If you need more information, please press the No. 9 button,” the voice said.

    After the man pushed the button, the line connected to a man who called himself a “clerk in charge of delayed repayment” in broken Korean.

    The man, who is in his 30s, protested, saying, “I don’t know anything about any delayed repayment.” Then, the “clerk” apologized and said the bank was at fault.

    After that, the clerk said, “We would like to protect your bank account. Please go to an automated teller machine (ATM) nearby. There, we will explain to you (through a mobile phone) how to operate the machine (in order to protect the account).”

    The man did not go to an ATM because he thought the call was fishy.

    When the man told a colleague about the call the next morning, the person laughed and said, “They called you, too? Which bank’s name did they use this time?”

    What would have happened if the man had followed the instructions and gone to an ATM?

    He would have been asked via his cellphone to transfer his money to a safe account. The “safe account,” however, is actually one opened under a fictitious name. Once such transfers are confirmed, the gang members operating the scam rush to a different ATM and withdraw the money.

    Since last fall, the scam known as “voice phishing” has spread rapidly in South Korea. About 4,200 such cases were reported between June 2006 and July this year, according to the National Police Agency (NPA) of South Korea. The financial damage of those cases totaled about 40 billion won (about 5 billion yen).

    In May this year, a judge was cheated out of 60 million won (about 7.5 million yen).

    The methods used in the scams are surprisingly varied.

    In some cases, culprits call to say, “Someone is shopping with your card.” In other cases, they say, “This is the police. We need to take security measures for the protection of your card.”

    In the case of the judge, a man who pretended to be his son called and asked for help.

    Another feature of the telephone scam is that crime rings are often led by non-South Koreans. Sixty percent of those arrested are Chinese or Taiwanese.

    For this reason, the NPA has invited Taiwanese police officers in charge of telephone scams to South Korea to jointly study the transnational crimes and exchange information on suspects at large.

    As a result of strengthened investigations, South Korean police arrested about 1,000 people in June and July. In addition, the number of telephone fraud cases in July decreased sharply to 138, which was about 20 percent of the record-high 699 cases in January.

    Taiwan has apparently become a stronghold of telephone fraud cases that have spread in some Asian countries.

    Late last year, Taiwanese police arrested two men, aged 29 and 35, in connection with telephone fraud cases. At that time, police officers were surprised to see that the suspects had been committing crimes in Asian countries by subtly using high-tech tools from Taiwan.

    The two, who were members of a group based in Taichung city in central Taiwan, allegedly defrauded TW$100 million (about 370 million yen) from hundreds of people living mainly in China, South Korea and Thailand.

    According to the police, the two men bought several mobile phones overseas in order to make it hard for Taiwanese police to track them. Then, using the mobile phones, other high-tech devices and discount Internet Protocol (IP) telephone lines, they built a system that enabled them to automatically make bulk calls or inundate computers with e-mail messages.

    They also recorded fake messages in several languages with the help of collaborators in Taiwan, China, South Korea and Thailand. For instance, one of the messages said, “Your telephone fee has not been paid yet.”

    The two kept sending such messages around the clock from Taiwan to other areas. When someone replied, they asked the person to transfer money from an ATM or a post office to an account opened under a fictitious name. One of the accounts was named, “Finance management bureau’s joint account.”

    According to the Criminal Investigation Bureau (CIB) of Taiwan, telephone scams started in Taiwan in the late 1990s and escalated into a serious social problem in 2000.

    Also around the same year, some groups in Taiwan started to relocate their bases across the sea to Amoy in mainland China’s Fujian province, and have since cheated people in and around the city in a similar manner in cooperation with local Chinese.

    In recent years, such groups have made inroads into South Korea, Vietnam, Thailand and the Philippines, CIB officials said.

    The structure of the crime organizations varies.

    In some groups, a Taiwanese heads a ring and its members are mostly Chinese. In other cases, Chinese who know the scam set up their own groups.

    In South Korea, the most common case is of Taiwanese leading the groups and Chinese who have come from China’s Liaoning and Shandong provinces working as telephone clerks. Most of those Chinese belong to the minority Korean ethnic group and can speak the Korean language.

    Zhang Wen Yuan, a high-ranking official of the CIB, said, “The basic business method (of those crime groups) is that they find people who are familiar with the language and situations of their target country. In Southeast Asia, they sometimes cooperate with local residents of Chinese ancestry.”

    The telephone frauds began to spread in Japan and Taiwan almost simultaneously. However, the connection between the groups in Japan and those in Taiwan is unknown.

    “There is no information that indicates that the telephone scams have spread from Taiwan to Japan or from Japan to Taiwan,” Zhang said.

    Paying attention to the similarities of the crimes in both areas, however, the Taiwanese police are now collecting information on similar crimes being committed in Japan.

    In the fraud cases, crime groups must withdraw money from victims through ATMs or other places. Because of the risk that those who withdraw the funds could be arrested by police, the crime groups use part-timers for that task.

    The crime groups advertise in Taiwan for overseas part-time jobs. In many cases, the groups advertise good “labor conditions,” such as “shouldering air tickets and hotel charges of part-timers.”

    Many of those who apply are unemployed.

    According to the Foreign Ministry in Taipei, more than 100 Taiwanese citizens who were overseas as “money collectors” have been arrested so far in South Korea alone.

    Criminal syndicates are also behind many of the telephone fraud groups. In several cases, local assembly members or company owners are offering money to the fraud groups so that they can buy mobile phones and pay telephone charges.

    “The fraud groups are becoming more and more like companies and are spreading their activities internationally,” a CIB official said.

    * * *

    Tsuyoshi Nojima in Taipei contributed to this article.(IHT/Asahi: October 18,2007)

  82. aokiookami Says:

    @Errol:

    Korea:
    - Nominal GDP: 1,033.9bn USD (2007f)
    - GDP per capita: 21,100 USD (2007f)
    - Population: 49,044,790 (US Bureau of the Census)

    Taiwan:
    - Nominal GDP: 365bn USD (2007f)
    - GDP per capita: 16,100 USD (2007f)
    - Population: 22,858,872 (US Bureau of the Census)

    China:
    - Nominal GDP: 3,133bn USD (2007f)
    - GDP per capita: 2,368 USD (2007f)
    - Population: 1,321,851,888 (US Bureau of the Census)

    Thailand:
    - Nominal GDP: 238bn USD (2007f)
    - GDP per capita: 3,640 USD (2007f)
    - Population: 65,068,149 (US bureau of the Census)

    Indonesia:
    - Nominal GDP: 413.1bn USD (2007f)
    - GDP per capita: 1,760 USD (2007f)
    - Population: 234,693,997 (US bureau of the Census)

    Philipines:
    - Nominal GDP: 139bn USD (2007f)
    - GDP per capita: 1,524 USD (2007f)
    - Population: 91,077,287 (US bureau of the Census)

    Source: Key Economic Indicators – Think tank of Deutsche Bank Group

  83. Errol Says:

    aokiookami Says:
    October 26th, 2007 at 5:47 am

    Posted some off-topic post about Koreans lack of technological sophistication and how they were easily gulled by savvy Chinese and Taiwanese,

    In direct contradiction of previous (off-topic) posts on how much more technologically Korea is vis-a-vis China.

    aokiookami Says:
    October 24th, 2007 at 11:21 pm

    And here’s what’s happening in China:
    1) Japanese and Korean gadget, phone and car makers release sleek, innovative new devices or vehicles domestically in Japan and Korea.
    2) Chinese rip-off companies buy one, and return to China where the whole thing is copied.
    3) The Chinese companies sell the fake version domestically in China.
    4) when the original is finally sold in China, Chinese consumers think the original is a counterfeit of a Chinese original, since the Chinese phone was sold first, and are OUTRAGED at the copyright violation.

    Hmm. Asia’s finest control freakery.

  84. Aude_Sapere Says:

    This is too awesome. Basically, with his superb actions, aookiokami is substantiating solidly and fantastically every criticism made on this website and beyond, against self-aggrandizing, inferiority-complex driven, ultranationalist netimaniacs that’re out there. Keep up the good work! It will only serve to unite moderates, and unite and harmonize Chinese and Japanese and SEAsian netizens against this unprecedented yet unsurprising movement in e-hate. Seriously, keep it up!

    To kjeff, sorry for the late reply, I was at work all day. My bad, but I still don’t quite catch your drift. Maybe we just don’t see eye to eye on that subject, or you’re looking it at from a different level than I am. Cheers anyhow.

    Oh yeah, aookiokami, I know actually a lot of Korean girls dating Chinese, SEAsian, and White men. Serious. Everyone, get ready for the impending storm!

  85. ponta. Says:

    (

    Korea is now considered to be among the most advanced societies when it comes to “gender equality and women’s rights”, even compared to the western countries:

    That means I can expect Korean people to voice for comfort women victimized under Korean rule.That is a great news.(-telling myself))

  86. kjeff Says:

    Aude_Sapere

    Oh yeah, aookiokami, I know actually a lot of Korean girls dating Chinese, SEAsian, and White men. Serious. Everyone, get ready for the impending storm!

    My wife married a S.E. Asian man…lol… I can’t agree with you more, this is TOO awesome.

  87. aokiookami Says:

    @Errol, as if we needed another reason to show how intellectually and morally bankrupt the Chinese are; the fact is that the “voice-phishing” scam is far from high tech, I was even told that the Chinese actually think cheating/copying is the highest form of flattery… [shaking my head in disbelief] No wonder why people call these morally-bankrupt-Chinese “human-shaped animals”…

    Anyway, here’s the 2007 global IT competitiveness ranking:
    1. United States 77.4
    2. Japan 72.7
    3. South Korea 67.2
    4. United Kingdom 67.1
    5. Australia 66.5
    6. Taiwan 65.8
    7. Sweden 65.4
    8. Denmark 64.9
    9. Canada 64.6
    10. Switzerland 63.5
    .
    .
    .
    41. Thailand 31.9
    .
    .
    49. China 27.9
    .
    .
    57. Indonesia 23.7
    .
    .
    61. Vietnam 19.9
    62. Azebaijan 18.8
    63. Nigeria 18.7
    64. Iran 15.7

    Relatively few countries possess all the factors necessary to support a thriving information technology sector, but the United States, Japan, South Korea and the United Kingdom provide the strongest environments for IT competitiveness, a new study concludes.

    Source: http://w3.bsa.org/asia-eng/press/newsreleases/eiu-study.cfm

    Also, here’s another interesting tidbit on the Korea’s IT prowess:
    Digital Korea: Convergence of Broadband Internet, 3G Cell Phones, Multiplayer Gaming, Digital TV, Virtual Reality, Electronic Cash, Telematics, Robotics, E-Government and the Intelligent Home (Hardcover)

    Digital Korea is a study of the most advanced country for digital convergence, South Korea. Much of what we see in South Korea today sounds like science fiction – but forms the solid reality of life in South Korea today. Thus, it is a great source of ideas and insights which we can learn from. The book discusses a country where every household internet connection has already been upgraded to broadband; where 100 mbit/s speeds are already sold and gigabit speeds already coming; where every phone sold is a cameraphone; where three out of every four mobile subscriptions is a 3G connection; where cars and PCs and mobile phones now ship with in-built digital TVs; where 42% of the population maintain a blogsite and four out of ten have created an avatar of themselves; where over half of the population pay with cellphones and 25% of the total South Korean population have participated inside a multiplayer online game, in fact inside the same multiplayer online game. The stories from South Korea are each more amazing than the last. 50,000 citizen journalists write the national Ohmy News newspaper. While Second Life fascinates western media for its 2 million users, South Korean Cyworld has 20 million users. While we tend to view the 8 million active users of the World of Warcraft as a milestone in massively multiplayer online games, South Korean Lineage already has 14 million active gamers. And perhaps most telling of all – the South Korean government is convinced every Korean home will have a household robot within ten years. Household robots? Not just cleaning our homes and providing security, but reading bedtime stories to our kids and helping them with their homework too. Digital Korea includes chapters on all these issues and more with the state-of-the-art latest products and services described in detail. This is one of the first attempts to understand the current state of digital convergence, ubiquitous computing and the information society that is South Korea. The book is called simply ‘Digital Korea’, but its subtitle is long as the stories in the book are so wide-reaching: Convergences of broadband internet, 3G cellphones, multiplayer gaming, digital TV, virtual reality, electronic cash, telematics, robotics, e-government and the intelligent home. The research for the book took a long time as so many different fields had to be covered. But the resulting book is now the most up-to-date view of that exact point where science fiction meets science fact. What happens when virtual reality meet the real world, with wireless reach and broadband speed? The book is packed with statistics and case studies and Tomi’s famous “Pearls”. As an interesting method, they have also often placed two rival statistics side-by-side, such as “In 2006 in USA 10% of music sales was digital” accourding to IFPI, and next to it on the opposing page “in 2006 in South Korea 57% of music sales was digital” also according to IFPI. This kind of comparisons help illustrate just how much of a lead South Korea has been able to pull.

  88. kjeff Says:

    aokiookami,
    Are you Korean or of Korean ancestry?

    No right-minded parents would want their daughter to marry an “illegal” immigrant from the poorer countries like Bangladesh, China or other third-worlds and live her life miserably. Actually, it’s not xenophobia but rather a desire to preserve and “further” improve the “quality of life” the people of S. Korea already enjoy…

    You should have stopped at “illegal,” and you would have been right.

    S.E. Asia…

    You’re missing Singapore, or Brunei…both have higher GDP per capita than S. Korea I think. I always feel that GDP per capita comparisons are semi-useless, even when they’re adjusted. Bruneians, for example, live in an almost socialist utopia with ‘free’ everything. Indonesia…sure Big Mac doesn’t cost much less than that of the U.S., but in most places, you can get a satisfying meal with less than 50 cents, that’s 500 won to Korean(don’t think that you are). And in Singapore, which probably has the highest cost of living among S.E. countries…if you go to any food court, you probably can get a roast duck rice combo(with soda) for a price of a KimBab(about 2000 won last time I bought them).
    .
    What’s my point again? Oh yeah, are you Korean? Come on, at least say something bad about Japanese… that’s real Koreans, right? lol…
    .
    Anyone know how to check his/her IP address…AT LEAST, based in Korea? Wait, you(not ‘you’ you Aude_Sapere) don’t really want to know…we’re having too much fun.

  89. kjeff Says:

    icwtrttakblsafdd

  90. Aude_Sapere Says:

    lol thats all i gotta say for now hahaa

  91. T_K Says:

    Ok, I get it, Korea’s dynamic, egalitarian and corruption-free. Can we get back on topic?
    Also, ookami, my hand is getting tired from scrolling past your pointless copy-pastes. I’m on a laptop and have to use a trackpad, see.

  92. Brian Says:

    As a Chinese guy dating a Korean girl, there as not been one instance of me encountering this “xenophibia” of Korean men. I’m not saying that it dosen’t happen, but this is a complex issue that has occured all over the world throughout history. In America, the same instances happen with white girls dating blacks. In China, white man Chinese girl relationships are met with harrassment and death threats. I have to agree with Kjeff that Matt was insinuating stereotypes about Korean men based on his narrow life experiance, hearsay and this one anecdote. Quite biased aren’t we Matt? And you’re intentions are even more obvious since you posted your anecdote the way you did on this site. What kind reaction did you think you were going to get with all these insecure anti-Korean nationals around? Your motive is as clear as water, my friend.

  93. empraptor Says:

    Your motive is as clear as water, my friend.

    I figured he had nothing better to post about. And it is one of his main gripes with Koreans – that they’ll cockblock non-Korean men. I think he’s had posts or at least comments along this line in the past.

    Seems like you infer a different motive? To stir up a beehive, so to speak? (see site’s logo above and realize I’m being funny then laugh)

    I can only assume he’s exaggerating and simplifying the topic in order to leave an impression on the reader, but it’s not like he’s… yeah ok so he’s biased. I wanted to insert something in his defense here, but nothing sounded very good. Well, I don’t think his motives are as sinister as you make it sound.

    If someone who was into Nigerian women complained that all Nigerian men cockblock, you’d assume his opinion comes from his frustration in his past interactions rather than some nefarious plan to make Nigerians go on a rampage. Not to say Matt’s into Korean women. Unless he is. Someone stop me from blathering on and on.

  94. Phil2Musashi Says:

    aokiookami: You are kind of correct in thinking that forging/copying has a long history in China, and is not looked down upon. This dates back over a thousand years ago; if one painter was popular, then EVERYONE had to have one of their paintings, even if there was more people than there was paintings by that artist.
    .
    That is why today, a large amount of older Chinese artwork is labeled “attributed to…so and so” instead of “painted by…so and so”.
    .
    Under these conditions, it is seen as flattery; an original piece is worth much more when people have to fight so hard to get a real one. Any SOB can have a fake, but you have to pay for the real thing.
    .
    And if you are looking for examples of moral bankruptcy, why not look closer to home to what your own people are doing rather than saying how much better it is than others.
    .
    It is easy to say we are better than the worst; it is difficult to say that we are the best.
    .
    There are people inside China who want to make a change for the better, and for that, they deserve praise. I am much more afraid of a country that thinks it is already perfect.

  95. General Tiger Says:

    kjeff:

    Anyone know how to check his/her IP address…AT LEAST, based in Korea? Wait, you(not ‘you’ you Aude_Sapere) don’t really want to know…we’re having too much fun.

    http://www.ip-adress.com

  96. Matt Says:

    Brian,

    As a Chinese guy dating a Korean girl, there as not been one instance of me encountering this “xenophibia” of Korean men.

    Same race, while this…

    In America, the same instances happen with white girls dating blacks.

    … Is inter-racial. Although you are of different ethnicities, you are same race and visibly so, and you are not going to attract attention like those of visibly different races.

  97. General Tiger Says:

    Matt:

    Same race

    I take offense at that comment. I never recognize the Chinese as the same race as Koreans/Japanese.

  98. Matt Says:

    I take offense at that comment. I never recognize the Chinese as the same race as Koreans/Japanese.

    No offense intended, but Japanese/Koreans/Chinese are part of the same broad racial category.

  99. GarlicBreath Says:

    I never recognize the Chinese as the same race as Koreans

    I am looking forward to China taking back what is hers. I respct the historical Chinese right to posess corea as a colony. I see this a a real possibility when North Corea fails and the generals in charge refuse to let the South in until the chinese have secured the nation.

  100. General Tiger Says:

    Matt:

    No offense intended, but Japanese/Koreans/Chinese are part of the same broad racial category.

    Under who’s standards? Yes, I know that you meant no offense, Matt, but I HATE being put into the same racial category with the Chinese. It’s like putting us in the same category as the Indians.
    .
    GarlicBreath:

    I am looking forward to China taking back what is hers. I respct the historical Chinese right to posess corea as a colony. I see this a a real possibility when North Corea fails and the generals in charge refuse to let the South in until the chinese have secured the nation.

    On the contrary, China needs to be pushed back to their rightful place: South of the “Great” Wall.

  101. GarlicBreath Says:

    On the contrary, China needs to be pushed back to their rightful place: South of the “Great” Wall.

    And who will push them? KAKAKAKA…Maybe the great dangun will be reincarnated in the body of Yonsama. kakakak kakakak kakakkakak
    .
    The scenario I gave is quite possible tigg, yours is some kind of corean nationalist fantasy.

  102. General Tiger Says:

    GarlicBreath:
    You seem to misunderstand me. I don’t really think that Korea has to take the land. I rather have Mongolia take back their piece and have a new country set up in the remaining parts.
    .
    Also, you seem to overestimate China. In a limited battlefield (like Manchuria), ROK can push back PRC easily. We have better tanks, artillery, fighters, etc. The only way PRC could win would be threatening the use of nuclear weapons.
    .
    Never underestimate or overestimate.

  103. GarlicBreath Says:

    Quite biased aren’t we Matt? And you’re intentions are even more obvious since you posted your anecdote the way you did on this site. What kind reaction did you think you were going to get with all these insecure anti-Korean nationals around? Your motive is as clear as water, my friend.

    Tigg, Maybe you can enlist blian in your battle with china. Servile corean apologist like blian are good at corean bootlicking. There are a few corean sycophant running around, one lardy dufus sellout runs a blog-aganda called the “hive” I think.

  104. GarlicBreath Says:

    I don’t really think that Korea has to take the land. I rather have Mongolia take back their piece and have a new country set up in the remaining parts.

    A new coutry called… mongolia? Mongolia and china at war. You need to get outside more often.
    .

    Also, you seem to overestimate China. In a limited battlefield (like Manchuria), ROK can push back PRC easily. We have better tanks, artillery, fighters, etc. The only way PRC could win would be threatening the use of nuclear weapons.

    How do the Coeran shock troops get to manchuria in this nationalist fantasy of yours? On the LPX Dokdo? What do you mean by “better” fighters? If your definition of better is determined by who can drink soju and beat women, well you could be right.
    .

  105. General Tiger Says:

    GarlicBreath:

    A new coutry called… mongolia? Mongolia and china at war. You need to get outside more often.

    Ever heard of Inner Mongolia? Mongolia should be able to take their old land back, and the remaining parts (Heilongjiang, Jilin and Liaoning) could be united to form a new country. How about you going outside a little more, oh ignorant one?

    How do the Coeran shock troops get to manchuria in this nationalist fantasy of yours? On the LPX Dokdo? What do you mean by “better” fighters? If your definition of better is determined by who can drink soju and beat women, well you could be right.

    Of course, having to pass through DPRK is a little problem, but if there’s a war over that little kingdom of Kim’s, then passing it should be easy. As for fighters, I was talking about the airplanes, my friend.

  106. Nakagawa Says:

    All korean do not racism act to austrailian.
    They like white people as well.

    just ‘you’ hated by korean.

  107. familyguyy Says:

    They like white people as well

    lol very well put…not….

    I don’t think its a matter of whether or not they do or don’t like Australians, this is not the point. Korean men do not approve of their women dating outside there race. This is a fact. Im sure they like Aussie’s but just don’t let the touch there girls.

    just ‘you’ hated by Korean.

    Well if this is true why does every single person I know who has dated a Korean girl had at least one experience with an over zealous OPPA trying to warn her against dating an aussie….

    Anyway do as I do if an Oppa try’s to cockblock u punch him in the face….

  108. Aude_Sapere Says:

    To General Tiger:

    You seem to hold Chinese/Indians pejoratively, but I’ll give you the benefit of the doubt. Anyway, all I gotta say is I lived in Korea and Taiwan over a considerable period, and I’ve toured China as well. Maybe you should too. I’m certain your worldview will be broadened immensely, especially regarding the racial categorization issue.

    The Japanese I definitely can say have more difference in genetics than Korea and China, considering the Japanese gene pool is actually more heteregeneous (Jomon + Yayoi + a touch of Siberian and Siberian Caucasian, briefly put). But like I said, I lived here for a while, and I have to disagree with your opinions.

    And to make another quip at Korean nationalist claims, Japanese didn’t all come from Korea. Calm down.

    But with all that aside, I’m just watching some old MMA videos, and I gotta say Genki Sudo has the right idea down: we are all one.

    Regarding land and territory, here is something you might want to know about Inner Mongolia, and Chinese history in general. I do agree that it is questionable that the current communist government is trying to say Goguryeo is straight-up Chinese. However, if you know anything about Chinese history, you should know that two Chinese dynasties were not even Chinese. You have the Yuan/Mongolian Dynasty and the Qing/Manchurian Dynasty. These two non-Han peoples conquered China, but guess what? They assimilated themselves into China. When the Manchurians took over and assimilated themselves to Chinese imperial culture, they assimilated their holdings in the Northeast into China as well.

    And actually, to address your geopolitical fantasies, Inner-Mongolia is over 75% Han: so, Mongolia taking Inner Mongolia back is actually a good thing for the PRC, LOL. Actually, it would be fantabulous for the CCP. Mongolian’s population is around just 3 million, while that of Inner Mongolia is hmm, gee, 24 million. And as aforementioned, about 80% of that is Han. So, if making Mongolia into another Chinese state us what floats your boat, what you said is nothing but an excellent, excellent idea.

    Why do you think Hu Jintao settled Northeastern land claims with Russia by CONCEDING to the Russians? Russian Far East – population = 7.5 million. You can look up the population statistics of Heilongjiang yourself.

    And Heilongjiang, Jilin, and Liaoning all have +80% Han populations. Hmm…make a new country? Look man, I know certain Koreans think Northeastern China belongs to them because Goguryeo conquered those lands. But that was like what? 1200 years ago? With that logic, I can just easily say those lands belong to China because the Manchus conquered them, and then conquered China, and then assimilated.

    To digress slightly, I think Tibet should be freed from Chinese rule, because there is an actual movement to do that, and there are people inside that want it to happen. Do you see people inside Heilongjiang, Jilin, Liaoning, and Inner Mongolia doing the same? Or is just you want to force your nationalist-rooted geopolitical fantasies onto unwilling people? Something like probably involves something else, called violence and bloodshed.

    And honestly, just to put in some more cents, if it wasn’t for Tang China’s help to Shilla, Korea arguably wouldn’t have been united for hundreds of years. Yes, Tang tried to backstab Shilla after helping it unite the Korean peninsula, which is regrettable. But that still doesn’t refute the fact that without Tang China, Shilla wouldn’t have been able to accomplish what it did.

  109. Aude_Sapere Says:

    And before saying anything else, don’t get me wrong. I respect Korea a lot. My best friend is Korean, and my girlfriend is Korean. Over 50% of my friends are Koreans and Korean-Americans. I just have a problem with overbearing Korean nationalist statements/claims, which occasionally leads to bashing other countries; even my Korean homies have problems with that.

  110. Nakagawa Says:

    I just have a problem with overbearing Korean nationalist statements/claims

    very well known chinese claim to the world :
    “origin of golf and soccer are ours!”
    “world first world trip was chinese!”
    “genghis-khan was chinese!”
    “chinese invented rocket!”
    “all of the World’s Chess games are made by chinese!”
    “china is the very first birthplace of human!”
    as i think, chinse more nationalistic than semi-western democracy country like korea and japan.

    also, some chinese claim okinawa was part of china. ‘once annex with taiwan next will okinawa.”
    http://military.china.com/zh_cn/history2/03/11027561/20070625/14179595.html

  111. Aude_Sapere Says:

    Nakagawa, I never said I agree with outrageous claims of Chinese people either. I have problems with them as well. But we were talking about those from Korea, weren’t we? Or do I see yet another example of deflection?

    Moreover, by your logic, I’m guessing the right approach toward outrageous, self-aggrandizing nationalist statement/claims is to make the same kind of statements/claims in return? Good one.

    Actually, while I do have problems with outlandish and arrogant utterances from certain Chinese people, the rocket citation is actually valid.

    Rockets: “The availability of black powder to propel projectiles was a precursor to the development of the first solid rocket. Ninth Century Chinese Taoist alchemists discovered black powder in a search for the Elixir of life; this accidental discovery led to experiments in forms of weapons like bombs, cannon and incendiary fire arrows and rocket-propelled fire arrows.

    Exactly when the first flights of rockets occurred is contested, some say that the first recorded use of a rocket in battle was by the Chinese in 1232 against the Mongol hordes. Reports were of Fire Arrows’ with ‘iron pots’ that could be heard for 5 leagues- 15 miles, and that upon impact, exploded causing devastation for 2,000 feet in all directions, apparently due to shrapnel.[3] However it may be that the Fire Arrows were simply arrows with explosives attached, and lowering iron pots may have been a way for a besieged army to blow up invaders.[4]

    Less controversially, one of the earliest devices recorded that used internal-combustion rocket propulsion was the ‘ground-rat,’ a type of firework, recorded in 1264 as having frightened the Empress-Mother Kung Sheng at a feast held in her honor by her son the Emperor Lizong.[5]

    Subsequently, one of the earliest texts to mention the use of rockets was the Huolongjing, written by the Chinese artillery officer Jiao Yu in the mid 14th century; this text also mentioned the use of the first known multistage rocket.[6] That southern China and Laotian community rocket festivals might then have been key in the spread of rocketry in the Orient was proposed by Frank H. Winter in The Proceedings of the Twentieth and Twenty-First History Symposia of the International Academy of Astronautics.[7]” – Wikipedia

  112. General Tiger Says:

    Aude_Sapere;
    I’m a bit busy atm, but I’ll be back to talk with you. It seems that we’ll be able to discuss things civilly.
    .
    Oh, and just a thing to chew on: I’m a East Altai-Baikal Nationalist, and I don’t accept the flood of Han Chinese to the north during the last two centuries as legitamite. That’s where I’ll start my point of view.
    .
    Have a nice day.

  113. Matt Says:

    I’m a East Altai-Baikal Nationalist

    Maybe I am dense but I do not know of that kind of nationalism at all. Care to explain what an East Altai-Baikal Nationalist is and believes in?

  114. General Tiger Says:

    Matt:

    Maybe I am dense but I do not know of that kind of nationalism at all. Care to explain what an East Altai-Baikal Nationalist is and believes in?

    Pretty much a nationalism centered on the Eastern wing of the Altai Language group people (Mongol/Tungus/Manchurian/Korean/Japanese).

  115. Errol Says:

    East Altai-Baikal Nationalism? Good question. Here’s the answer. It means:

    1/ A control freak attitude to history. Don’t ever, ever, ever question Mighty Oppa!

    2/ A control freak attitude to foreign companies like Lone Star being allowed to make a profit and take it out of Korea. Don’t ever, ever, ever take profits from Mighty Oppa!

    3/ Blocking foreign universities from setting up shop in Korea and “Oh the horror, the horror. Don’t ever meddle with the social engineering that places Korean men as the sky and women as the earth. And the exploitation of inebriated first-year university women by Mighty Oppa!

    4/ The rejection of foreign husbands but the celebration of Vietnamese women becoming domestic servants of Mighty Oppa!

    5/ The widespread myth that Korea’s economic success is not due to U.S. and Japanese economic support but the hard work of Mighty Oppa!

    6/ The rising divorce rate amongst working middle-aged women exhausted by working all day then arriving home to pander to the needs of the person who has frittered away the family’s finances. Mighty Oppa!

    7/ The endless shifting of blame to Japan for, inter alia, the misdeeds of North Korean abductions of Japanese women and children when the real culprit is those who don’t have the spine to stand up to Kim Jong-il. Mighty Oppa!

    8/ The same source of the control freakery that blames Korea’s environmental woes on furrners.

    9/ The same people who waste 25 000 US dollars of taxpayers’ money on prostitutes! Mighty Oppa!

    10/ The control freakery that always, always, always (except when blaming Japan) blames the USA for preventing Korean reunification. Mighty Oppa!

    11/ The control freakery that skulks around glof courses making 10 million dollars in sponsorships but at what cost? Mighty Oppa!

    11/ A denial of the widespread acceptance* of Narcissistic Personality Disorder (which is characteristic of the pathology) by Mighty Oppa!

    The behaviour referenced by both Matt and BananaBoi to Korean male behaviour in Australia needs to be considered in the wider context of Korea’s social system, especially Korea’s wacky education system. What’s the best way to get a boy into SKY? Make him believe that he is the sky. What about the female students? Ha! Not important, they will never, ever be members of the Mighty Oppa! Club.

    * (1998). Psychoanalytic Study of the Child, 53:141-158

    The Etiology of Narcissistic Personality Disorder

    Joseph Fernando, MPSY, M.D.

    This paper presents a view of the etiology of narcissistic personality disorder which, while not new, is at variance with the commonly held position that this disorder is the outcome of the insufficient gratification of the normal narcissistic needs of infancy and childhood.

    Hmm

    The contrary thesis is presented: that narcissistic personality disorder is the outcome of narcissistic overgratification during childhood. A fixation to this over-gratification interferes with the normal maturation and integration of the superego, leading to difficulties in self-esteem regulation and to a tendency to massive externalization. Clinical material is presented to support this view.

    Clinical material? A goldmine of clinical material can be found for this thesis in the Mighty Oppa! Club.

  116. Aude_Sapere Says:

    So basically, based on your starting point (East Altai-Baikal nationalism), Japanese colonialization and annexation of Korea was all good and sugar, and was nothing to be protested about and rather should be appreciated and celebrated, considering the Japanese, according to you, is after all in the same Altai peoples group.

    Also, I don’t think there exists concept of nationalism based on a language group. But I might be wrong.

    Anyway, before moving further, can you address some of the points that I made, that came before your switching of topic to this new language grouping issue?

  117. Aude_Sapere Says:

    Related note (you have to register, simple process though):

    http://www.alllooksame.com/exam_room.php

    I would like everyone to take Exam #1, to prove a point.

  118. Nakagawa Says:

    @Errol
    if your logic, Japan and China are more nationalistic to you.
    basically, no country welcome to foriegner.
    even austrailia.

    Anti-Black racism in China
    http://moderntribalist.blogspot.com/2005/04/anti-black-racism-in-china.html

    Racism in China
    http://app1.chinadaily.com.cn/star/2003/0417/cu18-1.html

    and as i think, Japan is ultra nationalistic country in the world. in Japan, you just treated as “gaijin”. just find google, too many racism source in internet.
    also, japan was reported by racism country by UN human right group(CERD).

  119. Nakagawa Says:

    @Aude_Sapere

    based on your starting point (East Altai-Baikal nationalism), Japanese colonialization and annexation of Korea was all good and sugar

    That’s very Odd.
    so, India should better colonialized by British. bcz, we are all “Indo-European languages”?

  120. Aude_Sapere Says:

    Nakagawa, are you even following the thread at all? Also, before you go on and digress/deflect again, can you at least address my retort at comment #111?

    At comment #116, I was trying to point out potential consequences if one choose to become an adherent to “East Altai-Baikal nationalism.” So if anything, if you got problems, you need to take that up with General Tiger instead. But anyway, thanks for your comment, since you just added more fuel to my argument. Sweet.

    And once again, you can cite all the articles, data, statistics on how supposedly more racist Japan and China is compared to Korea. Does that solve anything? Does that help Korea? No. Wake up.

    And if you are apparently so anti-Japan, why are you using a Japanese alias?

  121. kjeff Says:

    Aude_Sapere,
    I love the exam room, how did you know about it? Got almost half wrong…tsk…tsk…tsk… and, I thought I was pretty good in telling them apart.
    .
    This discussion really veered way off course(not directed to you), but I guess that’s the limitation of truthiness-finders of Korea.

  122. General Tiger Says:

    Aude_Sapere:

    Related note (you have to register, simple process though):

    http://www.alllooksame.com/exam_room.php

    I would like everyone to take Exam #1, to prove a point.

    What point? The point that it’s easy to tell apart the Chinese from Koreans/Japanese, but hard to tell the difference between Koreans and Japanese?

  123. Aude_Sapere Says:

    Obviously that wasn’t my point.

    Anyway, feel free to address the actual main points that I made in the previous posts, General Tiger?

  124. Aude_Sapere Says:

    Just to make sure you know what to address, for starters:

    Comment #116: So basically, based on your starting point (East Altai-Baikal nationalism), Japanese colonialization and annexation of Korea was all good and sugar, and was nothing to be protested about and rather should be appreciated and celebrated, considering the Japanese, according to you, is after all in the same Altai peoples group.”

    And comment #108 too, while we are at it.

  125. General Tiger Says:

    Aude_Sapere:

    Anyway, feel free to address the actual main points that I made in the previous posts, General Tiger?

    Working on it.

  126. Aude_Sapere Says:

    kjeff:

    Yea I think it’s pretty awesome too =). I actually came across it a year or two ago, back in my undergrad days. Just one of those things that gets rapidly circulated amongst the university community and whatnot.

    Again, for everyone else, feel free for some good kicks:
    http://www.alllooksame.com/exam_room.php

  127. HanComplex Says:

    Update: I was with a friend and three Korean girls this morning in a 24 hour Korean restaurant and when one of the girls went to the toilet she was followed by a Korean guy who intercepted her and told her not to meet foreign guys. When she got back she told the other girls what happened (and by default us too, since my friend and I both speak Korean).

    Why didn’t you just confront the little punk? Not exactly in a belligerent manner but just ask him why your friends shouldn’t meet with foreign guys (preferably in front of the girls to embarrass him.) Since you’re fluent in Korean this wouldn’t have been a problem. Just wanted to hear what kind of lame-ass reply he’d have given to justify his typical brand of “Oppa protector” Korean racism.
    .
    If he starts raising hell and tries to harm you and your friends, ask him to step out and clock the living kimchi out of him. Probably just a typical racist Korean wussy anyway. They’re a dime-a-dozen.

  128. familyguyy Says:

    If he starts raising hell and tries to harm you and your friends, ask him to step out and clock the living kimchi out of him. Probably just a typical racist Korean wussy anyway. They’re a dime-a-dozen.

    Han- The problem is that area where Matt was in is quite the “little Seoul” of Sydney, any hint of violence would have since a swarm of drunk Oppas come out of the near by club we had just left, not to mention our name tainted on every Soju serving resturant in the area…

  129. GarlicBreath Says:

    If he starts raising hell and tries to harm you and your friends, ask him to step out and clock the living kimchi out of him. Probably just a typical racist Korean wussy anyway. They’re a dime-a-dozen.

    Normally I would agree that this kyopo racist asshole needs some sidewalk justice, but the police in Austraila don’t determine guilt by ethnicity like they do in Corea.

  130. Matt Says:

    Normally I would agree that this kyopo racist asshole needs some sidewalk justice, but the police in Austraila don’t determine guilt by ethnicity like they do in Corea.

    Not sure if he was a kyopo or not – he looked like a foreign student to me.

  131. familyguyy Says:

    I really think Violence is not the way to deal with this issue, for any race to come to my country (and I use “my” in the sense that I was born here) live here, study here enjoy what we have to offer, but then warn others of their race not to even make friends with the inhabitants of that country shows an arrogance beyond contempt. After going out on the weekend with Matt, I can say without hesitation that this is the rule rather than the exception, any chance an OPPA gets he will warn a Korean girl away from you it happens at restaurants at clubs at pubs even at McDonalds (anyone who has been to Sydney lately will know of the massive explosion of Koreans in Sydney CBD), it doesn’t even matter if he knows the girl in question or not, he will tell her with a commanding authority that in order to maintain face stay away from that white Australian……Fuck this …this is about to change as it has happened once to often..

  132. arthurbliss Says:

    Update: I was with a friend and three Korean girls this morning in a 24 hour Korean restaurant and when one of the girls went to the toilet she was followed by a Korean guy who intercepted her and told her not to meet foreign guys. When she got back she told the other girls what happened (and by default us too, since my friend and I both speak Korean).

    here’s my anecdote. I dated couple of white girls, and my experience is that some white guys were uncomfortable seeing white girl dating asian guy. some stared at us with disapproving look, and in bar there was some instances when guys approaching to my girl and hitting on her even though I am standing next to her. also some waiters were very rude to us, and one grocery dude was decidely hostile to me.

    I have another korean friend who hangs out with his best white female friend. you see, since he lives in more conservative surburban areas he had more hostile reactions. for example, he told me that he had experiences that some drunk white guys yelling at them near 7-11, or making disparaging comment to them in street.

    I understand you guys’ anger at some stupid korean oppa’s attempt to cockblocking. but then you can see that kind of cockblocking in other countries too. so here’s my question (which was kjeff’s original question that no one bothered to answer)
    do you think that these stereotypes are uniquely Korean?

  133. Aude_Sapere Says:

    Yeah man, I catch your drift, arthurbliss. Growing up in the States, while I haven’t had any direct experiences with that, some of my friends sure did, and it was not cool. So yeah, to answer that question, those stereotypes are definitely not uniquely Korean. And anyone that does that irritates the crap out of me that’s for sure.

    But then, with that question answered, now what? They do it, we do it, so let’s call it a day? I guess my standpoint is, let’s acknowledge it and work on it positively together.

    And I wonder where General Tiger is…

  134. kjeff Says:

    This thread pissed me off…
    .
    There, I said it…kinda feel good getting that off my chest. So, a bunch of Korean guys decreasing your chance of scoring…wait a minute,

    The funny thing is that warning the girls off meeting Australian (”foreigners”) doesn’t even work.

    Hmmm…not really…
    No…not that, you just don’t think Koreans are a “model minority.” How can they be? They don’t like our boys “respecting” their girls.

    …my country (and I use “my” in the sense that I was born here) live here, study here enjoy what we have to offer, but then warn others of their race not to even make friends with the inhabitants of that country shows an arrogance beyond contempt.

    And hey, if the said Koreans were born and bred in Australia, it wouldn’t have mattered. They should still appreciate the fact that you let their great-granddad into ‘your’ country. Come on…if you are Koreans, you’re always going be immigrants, right? I mean it’s not like they’re ‘white’ or anything.

    After going out on the weekend with Matt, I can say without hesitation that this is the rule rather than the exception…

    Somebody needs to write the rules to the ‘exception to the rule’. Rule no.1: It needs to be more than once.
    .
    Bottom line, BOO F**KING HOO.
    .
    If I were born white, I would
    1. Have more chance to look like the sexiest man alive. Brad is my far cousin…hell, even babies like me better.(Read a study that babies prefer Caucasian face features compare to other races)
    2. Have more chance, compare to Koreans(or Asians), to play in the NBA. And how often do you hear girls start their ideal men as, “A tall, blah, blah, blah man.”
    3. Have more chance…let’s face it, dating me is ‘cool’, and marrying me is even ‘cooler’. It shows that you made it, baby.(Read a study about interracial marriage and the socially upward tendency of marriage)
    4. Best yet…I’d be a ‘notch’ to some ‘curious’ Korean(Asian) girls. I’d be like their ‘exotic’ fantasy.
    5. And, that’s really to name a few. The only place I can think of where being a ‘white’ me might not be so good is…the middle east, they probably got a price for my hide there.
    .
    And if you’re born Korean(Asian), you’d…
    1. Have more chance to look like Napoleon than a French man.
    2. Have more chance to be asked for a menu if you dressed down.
    3. If you wear glasses, have more chance to be mistaken for a musician, and not the cool kind, or worse, a mathematician.
    4. Have more chance…let’s face it, if your mom think that you’re cute, you’re prettier than my sister.
    5. Have more chance of scoring with a white guy than a white girl.
    6. ETC…

    BOO HOO!!!

  135. GarlicBreath Says:

    Bottom line, BOO F**KING HOO.
    .

    I think the real bottom line is that Coreans are full of bitter resentment.

    I dated couple of white girls, and my experience is that some white guys were uncomfortable seeing white girl dating asian guy. some stared at us with disapproving look,
    .

    This sounds like its all in your head. Did the white guys walk over to your date and tell her not to date a Corean men? No. And if they did, she can tell them to f*ck off. In Corean culture, racism is so ingrained, a corean man can try and control the dating of a coraen women even if they are total and complete strangers.

    and in bar there was some instances when guys approaching to my girl and hitting on her even though I am standing next to her

    The guys probally saw a totally bored woman and tried to talk to her. Was she your wife? Interesting how you think you own her and can control her. Its your story, so I am sure you can craft it to make anybody the bad guy, but I see nothing wrong with talking to a woman at a bar. So what if you are on a date. You sound very insecure, and I am sure woman can detect that.

  136. arthurbliss Says:

    Garlic Breath.

    man, I don’t know what to say. I was talking about some white dudes’ reaction when I was with my girlfriends and how uncool it was. and combine that with my friend’s experience and aude-sapere’s friend’s experience. I was just saying this cockblocking existed in other countries too and this is not cool.

    about the club,
    me and my GF was behaving like a couple (kissing and whatnot) and enjoying conversation
    but a guy abruptly interrrupted and started
    hitting on her with usual pick up lines while completely ignoring me.
    um, isn’t it rude to hiting a girl when it is so obvious that a man with her is her BF?
    so I firmly told him that she is my gf, then
    he grumbles and went away. I’m not 100% sure he did that because I’m asian, but I thought this is distinct possibility. at least, that kind of thing never happended to me when i was with asian gal.

  137. Matt Says:

    There, I said it…kinda feel good getting that off my chest. So, a bunch of Korean guys decreasing your chance of scoring…wait a minute,

    Ah, no, its a bunch of Korean guys interfering in my life regardless of whether I am trying to score or not. It means a waiter at a restaurant told my then Korean GF (my only Korean GF) back in 2001 that I she shouldn’t be meeting me. It means a friend of mine had his Korean girlfriend get called a whore by a Korean guy in a bar, swearing under his breath. It means that a couple of Korean men 3 months ago tried to pick a fight with myself and a friend of mine, openly telling a Korean girl that we were with that he felt bad that she was with foreign dogs. When it came to the point of fighting, the two ‘oppa’ backed down since it was two on two, bad odds for them. It means that Korean men think you are get enough to be a friend but not good enough to date a Korean woman.

    And hey, if the said Koreans were born and bred in Australia, it wouldn’t have mattered. They should still appreciate the fact that you let their great-granddad into ‘your’ country. Come on…if you are Koreans, you’re always going be immigrants, right? I mean it’s not like they’re ‘white’ or anything.

    I know this is not directed at me, but I will offer my viewpoint. If you are an ethnic Korean in Australia, you mostly likely are an immigrant, and if you are a ethnic Korean born in Australia, you are most likely a child. Australia was only opened to non-white immigration in the 70s, and Korean immigration came much later. In any event, if an ethnic Korean was born here they should be glad, not resentful, that a fellow Australian has managed to meet a girl. If they resent a fellow Australian just because they are white, then you could say they do not really show Australian values.

    If I were born white, I would
    1. Have more chance to look like the sexiest man alive. Brad is my far cousin…hell, even babies like me better.(Read a study that babies prefer Caucasian face features compare to other races)
    2. Have more chance, compare to Koreans(or Asians), to play in the NBA. And how often do you hear girls start their ideal men as, “A tall, blah, blah, blah man.”
    3. Have more chance…let’s face it, dating me is ‘cool’, and marrying me is even ‘cooler’. It shows that you made it, baby.(Read a study about interracial marriage and the socially upward tendency of marriage)
    4. Best yet…I’d be a ‘notch’ to some ‘curious’ Korean(Asian) girls. I’d be like their ‘exotic’ fantasy.
    5. And, that’s really to name a few. The only place I can think of where being a ‘white’ me might not be so good is…the middle east, they probably got a price for my hide there.

    1. Declared by white run magazines in white majority countries. What on earth do you expect? What happens in Korea? Utter nonsense.

    2. This is just bizarre. Choose a sport more appropriate to your size, or better yet, go to a country with shorter people, like Korea. Just because you or your family emigrated to the US doesn’t mean that you have been discriminated against because the locals are taller. Another bizarre complaint!

    3. Debatable, especially since so many Korean girls need to keep their relationships with white guys secret.

    4. Could apply to any person of a different race.

    5. Irrelevant, and a matter of geo-politics, not racism.

    arthurbliss,

    here’s my anecdote. I dated couple of white girls, and my experience is that some white guys were uncomfortable seeing white girl dating asian guy. some stared at us with disapproving look, and in bar there was some instances when guys approaching to my girl and hitting on her even though I am standing next to her. also some waiters were very rude to us, and one grocery dude was decidely hostile to me.

    I have another korean friend who hangs out with his best white female friend. you see, since he lives in more conservative surburban areas he had more hostile reactions. for example, he told me that he had experiences that some drunk white guys yelling at them near 7-11, or making disparaging comment to them in street.

    The difference is that I could line up a bunch of my friends and acquaintances and not one would agree with that kind of behavior, would condemn it, and would not excuse it. Nor would they try to minimize it by offering examples of other races of people doing it. On the other hand, tell this kind of stuff to Koreans and all you get is excuses, that Korean men are “conservative”, that the reason is that Korea has been attacked “900 times”, that the case of the “comfort women” makes Koreans wary of foreigners, etc.

    There is also a difference in extent. With Koreans it is absolutely pervasive, and if you are Korean then you know it is.

  138. GarlicBreath Says:

    I was just saying this cockblocking existed in other countries too and this is not cool.

    Ahhh yes, the “they do it too” defence. I am sure that cockblocking exists around the world, so time to put that tired old defence tactic of corean culture to bed.

    Mr Matt said it best:

    The difference is that I could line up a bunch of my friends and acquaintances and not one would agree with that kind of behavior, would condemn it, and would not excuse it. Nor would they try to minimize it by offering examples of other races of people doing it. On the other hand, tell this kind of stuff to Koreans and all you get is excuses, that Korean men are “conservative”, that the reason is that Korea has been attacked “900 times”, that the case of the “comfort women” makes Koreans wary of foreigners, etc.

    Thanks for the followup arthurbliss.

    Arbliss

    me and my GF was behaving like a couple (kissing and whatnot) and enjoying conversation
    but a guy abruptly interrrupted and started
    hitting on her with usual pick up lines while completely ignoring me.

    So now you were making out in a bar and some white dude started hitting on your girlfriend. Like I said, its your story, so you can make it up as you go along. What is the next twist of this “cockblocking” , I am sure you also were wearing boyfriend/girlfriend t-shirts.
    .
    Did this white dude tell your “girlfriend” who to date? That is the message of this post (IMHO).
    .
    This line of yours is worth repeting.

    hitting on her with usual pick up lines while completely ignoring me.

    If he is chatting up your girlfriend, maybe she liked him (or didn’t care for you much). A real girlfriend, that liked you, would have told him to buzz off and there would be no story. However it also seems that the fact that he ignored you may have been the real problem. If the white guy talked to you too, would you have felt better?
    .

  139. kjeff Says:

    Matt,

    Ah, no, its a bunch of Korean guys interfering in my life regardless of whether I am trying to score or not. It means a waiter at a restaurant told my then Korean GF (my only Korean GF) back in 2001 that I she shouldn’t be meeting me. It means a friend of mine had his Korean girlfriend get called a whore by a Korean guy in a bar, swearing under his breath. It means that a couple of Korean men 3 months ago tried to pick a fight with myself and a friend of mine, openly telling a Korean girl that we were with that he felt bad that she was with foreign dogs. When it came to the point of fighting, the two ‘oppa’ backed down since it was two on two, bad odds for them.

    You seriously need a new hang-out place. Nice to be the ‘foreigner’ for a change, no? I once had a drunk called me Bruce Lee, and challenged me to a fight. This “oppa” did not back down. A lot of my wife’s friends dated Caucasian men, and we went out with them countless time, and I’ve never experience what you did. Maybe there’s something in the North East water…

    It means that Korean men think you are get enough to be a friend but not good enough to date a Korean woman.

    Matt, I don’t condone these behaviors nor excuse them, but I’m afraid you’re not making an effort to understand how and why those came about, or if they are in fact uniquely Korean. And, why should you? It’s easier to just say, “Well, that’s Korean, what a bunch of hypocrite sobs.” Interracial relationships are complex…maybe it’d be wise to read more about the issue before succumbing to that oh-so-comfortable _______.
    Trying to be less confrontational, let me just say, there are plenty privileges of being a ‘white’ man. Perhaps, many that you take for granted.

    The difference is that I could line up a bunch of my friends and acquaintances and not one would agree with that kind of behavior, would condemn it, and would not excuse it. Nor would they try to minimize it by offering examples of other races of people doing it. On the other hand, tell this kind of stuff to Koreans and all you get is excuses, that Korean men are “conservative”, that the reason is that Korea has been attacked “900 times”, that the case of the “comfort women” makes Koreans wary of foreigners, etc.

    I’d match your ‘bunch’ and raise you some more… Again, maybe your experience is ‘unique,’ dare I say, maybe it’s you…maybe your vibe…maybe not, who knows. Gotta wonder though… you obviously dislike Korean men, and reading your other threads here, you obviously dislike a lot of things Korean, so why? Are Korean girls in Sydney that ‘attractive’?

    There is also a difference in extent. With Koreans it is absolutely pervasive, and if you are Korean then you know it is.

    One name, Harold Ford Jr. From wikipedia,

    In October 2006, as polls indicated that Ford maintained a slight lead[citation needed] in the Senate race against Bob Corker, the Republican Party ran a television advertisement[38] wherein a blonde white woman, played by Johanna Goldsmith, talks about meeting Ford, who is unmarried, at “the Playboy party.”[39] The ad was denounced by many people, including former Republican Senator and Secretary of Defense under Bill Clinton William Cohen, who called it “a very serious appeal to a racist sentiment.” Corker himself asked the Republican leadership to pull the ad, which it refused to do. Corker subsequently pulled ahead in the polls and went on to defeat Ford in the November election.[40][41]

    I wonder what “racist sentiment”…
    In reverse, I wonder how many hate-mail Mila Jovovich got for sleeping with Denzel in “He Got Game”.

  140. arthurbliss Says:

    The difference is that I could line up a bunch of my friends and acquaintances and not one would agree with that kind of behavior, would condemn it, and would not excuse it. Nor would they try to minimize it by offering examples of other races of people doing it. On the other hand, tell this kind of stuff to Koreans and all you get is excuses, that Korean men are “conservative”, that the reason is that Korea has been attacked “900 times”, that the case of the “comfort women” makes Koreans wary of foreigners, etc.

    There is also a difference in extent. With Koreans it is absolutely pervasive, and if you are Korean then you know it is.

    yes. you are right about that. I also think those korean oppas are ignorant. but, koreans experiencing this multiethnic society started only late 90′s. please give them some slack. they are ignorant now, but hopefuly they will catch up soon. i’m still surprised about your constant encounter with oppa though, I lived in the state for such a long time, but I havn’t see or heard about korean men showing overt racism toward WM/AF couples. I heard couple of negative comments about korean girls exclusively dating caucasian dudes in 술자리, but that’s about it.

    Like I said, its your story, so you can make it up as you go along.
    I am sure you also were wearing boyfriend/girlfriend t-shirts.
    “maybe” she liked him (or didn’t care for you much).
    You “sound” very insecure, and I am sure woman can detect that.
    However it also seems that the fact that he ignored you “may” have been the real problem.

    your wild imagination entertains me.
    You wish my anecdote is imagnery, and I’m insecure & control freak and my ex-GF is a slut.
    well, dream on. ;)

  141. General Tiger Says:

    Aude_Sapere:

    And I wonder where General Tiger is…

    Taking mid-terms, working at his intern job, and trying to avoid writing an entire paper in his soon-to-be continued discussion with Aude_Sapere.
    .
    I have a life that I need to stabilize before doing things here >_> I’ll try to post by Friday.

  142. BananaBoi Says:

    If I were born white, I would
    1. Have more chance to look like the sexiest man alive. Brad is my far cousin…hell, even babies like me better.(Read a study that babies prefer Caucasian face features compare to other races)
    2. Have more chance, compare to Koreans(or Asians), to play in the NBA. And how often do you hear girls start their ideal men as, “A tall, blah, blah, blah man.”
    3. Have more chance…let’s face it, dating me is ‘cool’, and marrying me is even ‘cooler’. It shows that you made it, baby.(Read a study about interracial marriage and the socially upward tendency of marriage)
    4. Best yet…I’d be a ‘notch’ to some ‘curious’ Korean(Asian) girls. I’d be like their ‘exotic’ fantasy.
    5. And, that’s really to name a few. The only place I can think of where being a ‘white’ me might not be so good is…the middle east, they probably got a price for my hide there.

    Kjeff, you poor little korean boy, being repressed by the White Man. Get out of the victim’s mentality. It’s funny you used Brad as an example. In the movie Troy, Brad Pitt said “Out there lies immortality, Take it its yours!” Take control of your life and stop being so insecure!

    Peace out.

  143. Matt Says:

    You seriously need a new hang-out place.

    I live in the CBD, and it is filling up with Koreans. There is nowhere I can go.

    Nice to be the ‘foreigner’ for a change, no?

    Not sure what you mean…

    I once had a drunk called me Bruce Lee, and challenged me to a fight. This “oppa” did not back down.

    That is too bad. You have my sympathy.

    A lot of my wife’s friends dated Caucasian men, and we went out with them countless time, and I’ve never experience what you did. Maybe there’s something in the North East water…

    Probably because you were there. It doesn’t happen when you are together with Korean guys since other Korean guys assume the Korean guy with you is in control of the situation.

    Matt, I don’t condone these behaviors nor excuse them, but I’m afraid you’re not making an effort to understand how and why those came about, or if they are in fact uniquely Korean. And, why should you? It’s easier to just say, “Well, that’s Korean, what a bunch of hypocrite sobs.” Interracial relationships are complex…maybe it’d be wise to read more about the issue before succumbing to that oh-so-comfortable

    Wait, wait, why should I read about inter-racial relationships? What kind of understanding am I supposed to come to? Would you say the same thing if I went around warning non-Korean girls that Korean men beat up their wives and girlfriends, and that they should not meet them? Come on!

    Trying to be less confrontational, let me just say, there are plenty privileges of being a ‘white’ man. Perhaps, many that you take for granted.

    What privileges? Before the 1970′s there were virtually no non-whites in Australia except for a handful of aboriginal people. In what manner did non-white immigration create ‘privileges’ for white people?

    Gotta wonder though… you obviously dislike Korean men, and reading your other threads here, you obviously dislike a lot of things Korean, so why? Are Korean girls in Sydney that ‘attractive’?

    Ah, no, I do not dislike Korean men. I am fine with any Korean man that is fine with me. You are fine with any white man that is fine with you too, right? In fact, I am fine with any person that is fine with me no matter where they are from.

    Maybe you cannot see it for whatever reason, kjeff, but this is a common experience among anyone that knows Koreans, not an experience unique to me. It can happen whether you are dating a girl or not since the Korean guy will assume that is what you are doing or trying to do. My first experience with this was in 1999 when I was in a bar with a Korean female friend, who was just a friend, and who was approached by a Korean guy that had admonished her in Korean not to associate with foreign men. Of course I did not speak or know Korean at all, and when she told me what happened later, I had simply thought he was a reactionary troglodyte, and I had no idea at the time that it was part of a larger thought process shared among many Koreans.

    I have been to many countries in the world, and met a great many other peoples from all kinds of countries right here in Sydney, and I can say with surety that none of them do it quite like Korean guys. I know you would like to imply that I am racist and have something racist against Koreans, but Japanese are the same race as Koreans and they are not doing it.

    Am I that wrong to question why Korean guys want cast Australian men in a bad light?

  144. kjeff Says:

    Matt,
    I too have been to…well, let’s just say that I’m fortunate to have been dealing with the more enlightened half of the Korean people. My suggestion, on reading more of interracial relationship issue, pertain to the stats that over 2/3(don’t remember the exact number) Asian-White relationships are between Asian women and White men. I don’t remember exactly, because it’s a long time ago and I can’t find them right now, but there are a number of reasons for the asymmetry, immigration policy, the construction of masculinity, stereotypes, physical characteristics, socially upward tendency of marriage, among others.
    .
    So what?
    .
    Well, there’s really up to you.
    .
    And, Matt…I didn’t mean to imply, in any way, that you are racist. I think you’re not trying see beyond what you experience. I think you’re quick to generalize a group of people based on your experience. Those are generally things that I myself try to avoid, and try to get others to do the same. I often got into arguments with my dad whenever he started a sentence with, “MeiKwokRen is…, or INiRen is…” I don’t know, I guess I was always taught(by way of education) to question my own experience. I guess…we just have to agree to disagree.

  145. Errol Says:

    kjeff Says:
    October 30th, 2007 at 6:29 pm

    (1)… over 2/3(don’t remember the exact number) Asian-White relationships are between Asian women and White men…

    (2) … I think you’re quick to generalize a group of people based on your experience.

    (1) This is not about “relationships” per se. It is about Korean males using standover tactics and intimidating women to not to talk to foreigners. They do not have the temerity to do this mano-a-mano.

    (2) Stereotyping? Limited experience? Ha! I have a lot more experience in Korea, China, Japan and Australia (and a few other countries not germane to this discussion) than yourself. This is a Korean male phenomenon. It doesn’t happen to anywhere near the same extent in China or Japan. Here’s a couple of anecdotes that occurred on the same day.

    (A) In China I was leaving the gym to say goodbye to my yoga teacher (Chinese early 30s and very attractive). After I leave a Korean male starts cutting into her in Chinese, “Don’t talk to the foreigner. Foreigners are bad cannot be trusted.”

    (B) Within half an hour I’m in the supermarket. I’m having trouble communicating with Chinese salesgirl (doumi, not checkout girl) about a special offer on a new brand of tea. A young Chinese male helps me by translating her instructions to take the receipt after clearing the checkout to get the special prize.

    What am I to conclude about (A) and (B) when these incidents occur on a daily basis?

    (B) Chinese male: honest, friendly, helpful. Does not have insecurity complex as the one-child policy in China has produced males who realise that they are not superior to either females and concomitantly not superior to males of other races. The young Chinese males are not constantly reminded by the media, the education system and their mothers of their superiority.

    (A) Draw your own conclusion.

  146. BananaBoi Says:

    I posted this way back in December 2006 in Occidentalism which I think is relevant to the Thanks Oppa topic.

    I was recently invited to a cruise party held by an Australian English Language School. When I boarded the cruise there must be at least 10 different nationalities being represented in there. The people was very friendly and nice, they were all enjoying themselves, talking, laughing and dancing.
    Even though they had cultural and language barriers, they were able to communicate and ENJOY themselves. Everyone was mingling but not the Koreans, they kept to themselves and sat in their own little corner, they did not once try to chat or mingle with the other people in the party. When people approached and offered to dance with them, the Koreans rejected their offer (and not too politely might I add).
    So I approached 2 Koreans girls, they seemed nice and I started to chat with them, suddenely out of nowhere a Korean guy came up to us, gave me a dirty look, spoke korean to the 2 girls and pulled them away. I later found out (through one of their classmates) he was’nt their boyfriend, just a normal friend.

    “Koreans want to keep Korea Korean. We value our cultural ties to bloodline and a monoculture. This is what makes us Korean. We do not want foreign blood integrating with our own, for then we would no longer be Koreans.”

    This is fine with me, but why on earth do Koreans come to Australia?? When you come into my house, I don’t put up with such anti-social behaviour. I would like to remind all Koreans staying in Australia. If you don’t like our way of life, if you don’t like to mingle with Australians, then you can all get the hell out of my country!

  147. kjeff Says:

    Errol,

    Stereotyping? Limited experience? Ha! I have a lot more experience in Korea, China, Japan and Australia (and a few other countries not germane to this discussion) than yourself. This is a Korean male phenomenon. It doesn’t happen to anywhere near the same extent in China or Japan.

    LOL…
    “Ha! …than yourself,” hmmm… I wouldn’t presume otherwise, but…lol…thank you for that ‘tell’, I feel like I know you better.

  148. Matt Says:

    I too have been to…well, let’s just say that I’m fortunate to have been dealing with the more enlightened half of the Korean people. My suggestion, on reading more of interracial relationship issue, pertain to the stats that over 2/3(don’t remember the exact number) Asian-White relationships are between Asian women and White men. I don’t remember exactly, because it’s a long time ago and I can’t find them right now, but there are a number of reasons for the asymmetry, immigration policy, the construction of masculinity, stereotypes, physical characteristics, socially upward tendency of marriage, among others.

    What does that have to do with what I wrote about? Most of these guys have only been in Australia for less than one or two years, have grown up in Korea where they are members of the dominant race, and are entirely unassociated with the American controversies you have cited.

    What has it got to do with it?

  149. familyguyy Says:

    Another problem I frequently come across, is that the OPPA will pertain to have “heard” things about me or the relevant Caucasian in question, to the affect that he is dangerous or a player, now this is always utter bullshit the OPPA has no idea who me or the person is in question is, but it puts a seed of doubt into the girls mind which in the end serves for them to not meet again.
    My experiment which I will conduct tonight will involve a fake name job age and area of residence, I will then ask the Korean girl to ask her OPPA what he thinks about me, I will place money on the fact he will say “oh he playboy he dangerous, very famous”. Of course this is a very hard thing to actually test but I will see what I can come up with :D stay tuned

  150. HanComplex Says:

    Kjeff, you poor little korean boy, being repressed by the White Man. Get out of the victim’s mentality. It’s funny you used Brad as an example. In the movie Troy, Brad Pitt said “Out there lies immortality, Take it its yours!” Take control of your life and stop being so insecure!

    Amen.

    “Koreans want to keep Korea Korean. We value our cultural ties to bloodline and a monoculture. This is what makes us Korean. We do not want foreign blood integrating with our own, for then we would no longer be Koreans.”

    That’s pretty much common knowledge for non-Korean people who know enough Koreans or familiar with Korean culture. Maybe the result of this adherence to monoculture and a closed bloodline over thousands of years is severe inbreeding, which leads to mental and psychological disorders. That would explain perfectly why Koreans act and think the way they do today.

    This is fine with me, but why on earth do Koreans come to Australia?? When you come into my house, I don’t put up with such anti-social behaviour. I would like to remind all Koreans staying in Australia. If you don’t like our way of life, if you don’t like to mingle with Australians, then you can all get the hell out of my country!

    Unfortunately it’s just not Australia that’s a victim of their mass and continued exodus from their Great Homeland. North America, Japan, and other first-world countries generously welcome these ungrateful refugees with open arms. The great irony is, if they think so highly of their Motherland why do they desperately escape like rats from a sinking ship in the first place?
    .
    What’s worse is they bring their backward and underdeveloped culture with them wherever they’re transplanted. Then you end up with people like Cho Seung-hui, Robert Kim, and thousands of Korean whores. It would really be in the best interest of these governments to limit or just ban their immigration. Then they’d have fewer things to worry about.

  151. kjeff Says:

    Matt,

    Most of these guys have only been in Australia for less than one or two years…

    Just to be clear, most of these guys, the cockblocking ones that you generalized as “Korean men” earlier, are only those Koreans who have been in Australia for less than one or two years…OR, most Korean men in Australia(or, Sydney) have only been there for less than one or two years?
    .
    Come to think of it, that’s kind of a trick question…or, maybe not…maybe Koreans did start to immigrate to Australia less than two years ago.

  152. Errol Says:

    HanComplex Says:
    October 30th, 2007 at 9:48 pm

    What’s worse is they bring their backward and underdeveloped culture with them wherever they’re transplanted. Then you end up with people like Cho Seung-hui, Robert Kim, and thousands of Korean whores. It would really be in the best interest of these governments to limit or just ban their immigration.

    That is stereotyping. Two types of Koreans leave Korea. Group 1: those who wish to learn from Western countries, or Japan or wherever and; Group 2: those who stay in closeted communities where they can bully and ostracise (wanggta) anyone who doesn’t submit to oppa’s demands. In Group 1 are people like Dr Seo the current boss of KAISTand in Group 2 people like Lee Eui-ryoung.

  153. kjeff Says:

    ExceptMe,

    Maybe the result of this adherence to monoculture and a closed bloodline over thousands of years is severe inbreeding, which leads to mental and psychological disorders. That would explain perfectly why Koreans act and think the way they do today.

    and,

    What’s worse is they bring their backward and underdeveloped culture with them wherever they’re transplanted.

    Those are not racist statements, right?

  154. Phil2Musashi Says:

    http://youtube.com/watch?v=KO-tobS1nl0
    .
    Every body is a little bit racist, sometimes!

  155. GarlicBreath Says:

    What’s worse is they bring their backward and underdeveloped culture with them wherever they’re transplanted.

    Very true!

    Those are not racist statements, right?

    Its very ugly of you to constantly try and paint people as racist if you don’t agree with them.

    .
    Its open to debate if corea is developed or not developed. Your supreme leader Nom Moo Hyun admits corea is not developed.
    .
    Calling corea backward is appropriate. Backwards, refers to backwards corean culture practices like wifebeating and dogeating. Dog eating and wife beating are not civilized.

  156. Jenny Says:

    This site isn’t racist, it’s fine to have such interest in correcting the nitty gritty details of a foreign nation, (although quiet a unique focus) however posters like GarlicBreath definitely is.

    By any logic it is quiet obvious that these generalisations he is making is considered ‘racist.’ His constant use of ‘all coreans’ sure is an empirical evidence of this. There are countless evidences of this act of generalised racist slurs all over this site, if one bothered to read all the comments made by Garlic Breath. Yet you have the audacity to justify your generalised logic like here. ‘Calling corea backward is appropriate. Backwards, refers to backwards corean culture practices like wifebeating and dogeating. Dog eating and wife beating are not civilized.’ GarlicBreath.

    So where is your factual evidence to support your claim that because a certain minority may support dog eating and wife beating (which happens in other countries as well) you have the right to make a prejudice generalization of each and every ‘corean?’
    I’ve noticed you are dissatisfied with the fact that SOME Koreans tend to generalize the Japanese or American, so then how do you rationalize your own personal actions?
    You’ve also stated:
    “Coreans do take great offence when anybody challenges their chauvinistic and corea-centric view of the world”Garlic Breath.
    Well you are doing the same whenever someone challenges YOUR chauvinistic egocentric view on the topic of korea.

    You cannot in anyway expect an ethnic group to be pleased with being stereotyped in a negative view. This is identical to labelling every Middle Eastern or American a terrorist, and expecting every single person of that ethnic group to be satisfied with that label. Where is the logic behind that?
    Some people on this site have been critical on the fact that SOME Korean people are holding a grudge on the entire nation of Japan for the actions of their government. What difference does it make when Garlic Breath and Matt here is slandering the entire nation and anybody of Korean ethnicity for their governments actions? Oh the irony.
    He then goes into a denial mode, and refuses to admit that his words are ‘racist.’

    Have you ever considered why so many people have challenged you, if what you were saying was so legit? Could each and every one of those people be so damn stupid and ignorant that they cannot distinguish the difference between healthy criticisms with generalised racist statements? I believe not.
    Anybody with half a brain and no pre-conceived opinion on Korea regardless of their ethnicity would believe what you are suggesting here, in the name of anonymity of the Internet is definitely crossing the line of healthy criticism and is a dangerous form of racial hate.
    It seems you get a kick out of fooling around in a battle of ego with other outraged ‘konglish’ posters. (Which the term itself is resorting to derogatory name-calling)
    Perhaps if you aren’t still convinced you may want to listen to second opinions from non koreans, away from this website as people here already share your view on korea and listen to their opinions see how they respond to your comments.
    What motivates you to keep up your passion for this rather specific topic just startles me but I being quiet liberal in my mind will not interfere with your hobby, however please take a break from your hobby of slandering an ethnic group and getting the kick out of reading outraged uneducated Koreans, instead grab a cup of coffee and th drop your huge ego and ponder and why so many people are outraged by your claims. Chances are you are probably doing something wrong.
    Or if that’s still not good enough to get past your stubborn ego of refusing to listen to others, perhaps change every word, ‘Corean’ to another ethnic group that you strongly favour and are patriotic of, and try re reading that sentence and see if that raises your own blood pressure too.
    Of course considering you are one of those people that would refute a claim to death even in situations where you are obviously wrong, you would still probably want to block your ears, inflate yourself and float away in your world and convince yourself with the help of the like minded on this website that you aren’t racist. But please do try one of my suggestions.
    I say this as I highly doubt I’m dealing with an avant-garde thinker who is really so ahead of time that the rest of humanity cannot understand his logic. Don’t be too disheartened about facing reality, you can do it. ☺ Perhaps a visit to the shrink may also help your mental health mate. Cheers. Bottom line is, you are racist and being in denial isn’t the way to solve the problem.

    PS: yes I am Korean living in Australia, NO I do not appreciate your ridiculous generalisations of Koreans as I do not exactly meet any of your racist remarks ie: I do not support dog eating like many other Koreans, I have no problem with Japanese people, am educated enough to not hate an entire nation for their governments problems, believes Korean governments aren’t doing any better, has studied Japanese for years like many Korean people and YES I believe there is something wrong with this website and it’s in the people like Garlic Breath that encourages racial barriers and hatred with his constant comparing of two nations, uncalled for slandering, bias/generalisation and general negative attitude towards anything Korean to state to purposely stir up further angst.
    In fact, it seems its not the Japanese people that most Koreans are angry about but rather nationality confused white people like Garlic breath who lives in self pity that he wishes he was born of another race and suddenly believes he can be the voice of a foreign nation. No it isn’t working dear.

  157. wiesunja Says:

    I think Garlic Breath is hilarious….
    You Coreans need to chill out..oh, right…I forgot, you don’t understand the concept.

  158. Jenny Says:

    It’s easy for you to say,

    as I suggested to GarlicBreath, why don’t you change every word on this site that says “Korean” swap it to a country you are patriotic of and re read everything and see if you can keep a straight face. :)

  159. kjeff Says:

    Jenny,
    I’m sorry to say…you’re expecting too much from GarlicBreath…well, since I’m naming names, let’s include his better-half, HanComplex. They’re not gonna change. I’m fairly new to this site(just this year) so I’m not sure if you’ve been here before, but I think the point is really not to exchange ideas, but to have fun. I have fun ridiculing GarlicBreath and Co., and they have fun ‘thinking’ they are doing the same, and so on.
    .
    Oh, what rhymes with Jenny…hmmm…well, you’ll find out soon enough.

  160. GarlicBreath Says:

    WOW Good Grief, Jenny, you sure are ranting. PHEW…. you feel better now?
    .
    good. Breath in … relax.. calm down..so much anger for somebody who is so young…
    .
    If you want to discuss issues, pleases lets do so.
    .
    I expect you to support your claims too. Calling me a racist because you disagree with me is childish, and shows you have no real arguement. If I am racist, please prove that, or at least provide evidence. Citing another co-ethnic nationalist who yells racism as proof is not acceptable. .
    .
    By calling me a racist, you are just making a corean version of godwin’s law.

  161. General Tiger Says:

    GarlicBreath:

    By calling me a racist, you are just making a corean version of godwin’s law.

    Then I guess the only way to avoid it is to call everyone backwards, given that wifebeating happens everywhere.
    .
    Now who’s the one with Godwin’s Law, Garlic?

  162. GarlicBreath Says:

    You are very selective in your reading Tigg. Dog-eating goes on everywhere too? Yes Coreans eat dogs, (no Jenny, not each and every Corean eats only dogs all day long)
    .
    Everyone eats dogs? and cats too like in Corea? Tigg, does everyone ask Corea help for their brides so they dont get beat to death?

    Now who’s the one with Godwin’s Law, Garlic?

    Jenny (but she is corean, so I am sure you will give her a pass)

  163. General Tiger Says:

    GarlicBreath:

    You are very selective in your reading Tigg.

    I was selective because you’re lumping universal things with “Korean” stuff (although there are quite a few places that eats dogs, it’s just that we’re too developed to be ignored.)

  164. Jenny Says:

    rac·ism (rā’sĭz’əm) Pronunciation Key
    n.
    0. The belief that race accounts for differences in human character or ability and that a particular race is superior to others.
    2. Discrimination or prejudice based on race.

    Everything GarlicBreath ever writes is the epitome of this.

    ‘coreans in Indonesia like those in the article are filthy animals.’

    “Calling corea backward is appropriate. Backwards, refers to backwards corean culture practices like wifebeating and dogeating.”

    “Coreans do take great offence when anybody challenges their chauvinistic and corea-centric view of the world”

    ‘Typical arrogance from a blind nationalist coreans.’

    ‘Yes he is dishonest. Its odd that real coreans would never EVER accept him as corean, yet on the internet he is a corean nationalist.

    ‘(strange how Corean whores surrond the world, yet there were none during wwII)’

    ‘Corean product are only going to be around for a few more years. China will gobble up the low end market and the cheep corean garbage will be replaced with chinese products. Good bye SamDung.’

    ‘Corea owes a lot to Japan. Coreans have no idea about their own history. Its a shame they hate japan so much, yet owe so much to the kind Japanese people.’

    Do I need to prove more on this archetypical case? Talk about reverse racism.

    Like I said, I highly dobut I’m talking with an avant-garde thinker who is so ahead of time in his logic that the rest of humanity has difficult in grasping his concepts.. Again, have you ever considered why so many people on this site is having problems with you? Please read my other statement as well. I’ll paste it here for your convenience.

    kojibomb Says:
    December 23rd, 2006 at 5:06 am
    omg… garlicbreath
    you better stop accusing every one who disagree with you a Korean liar… including me and AkihitoMojito
    I smell kimuchi?
    wow beginning to get pissed off here
    you are so happy when we agree with you talking negative sides of Korea but when we disagree like on here about Samsung… you just change completely…
    I see a nasty bigot right here~~
    not really fun isn’t it?

    Me:
    ^
This is because GarlicBreath is a biased racist that also happens to be unbelievably stubborn and by far holds stronger self importance and pride than most of the Koreans that he is criticising here.
    Gerry makes healthy criticisms, but GarlicBreath obviously doesn’t and stirs up a lot of trouble. He obviously enjoys it. He literally hates anything Korean and glorifies anything Japanese and wonders why some Korean people on this site is outraged by the constant bitchy comparison he makes to make Koreans feel inferior. He encourages it and taunts them on purpose. It’s like kicking someone in the balls as a joke and questioning why he is hurt by it. That’s his logic to everything, its ridiculous. It’s best to ignore him, as he obviously lacks any moral and ethical values.
Obviously truth hurts to some Koreans, but his way of approaching them is not gonna get him any brownie points at all. Then again, if anybody was as picky and cruel hearted as he is, I could pin point out 1000s of things wrong about him and the things he favours. That’s if one BOTHERED to be that pessimistic with life and spend most of their time looking up negative issues about korea like he does. Someone surely has some self esteem problem to go to that extent of resorting to bringing another nation down to make himself feel better. He gets stirred up with any chance that allows him to bring down korea, and yet he condemns if a korean person gets stirred up like he does. Such an irony I blame his sheer ego. Should you not taunt them from the first place, they wouldn’t have any problems with you.
Lets pretend you are obese and fat and barely have any hair on your scalp.
I as an ethical being despite knowing this as a fact would make the moral decision to not pin point this out to you and stamp these evidential facts in your bones until you commit suicide.
    I’d really like to know GarlicBreath’s intention of his constant bitching, yes he is literally bitching about everything Korean.
Does this help you sleep better at night? what is it? Were you mistreated at Samsung that you hold such grudge? Did a Kimbap almost make you choke and die of suffocation? There has to be a cause for all this unhealthy hate. I don’t consider GarlicBreath’s comments to be wise criticisms like Gerry’s. He seriously needs professional help as much as some Korean people here do because of his provoking.
    Perhaps with that spiteful mind of yours, why can’t you then at least relate to some koreans and their vengefulness regarding their colonization etc? Seems very hypocrtical don’t you agree?
    —————————————————————————————————–
    It seems evidentially clear that you love to jump at anything and everything nasty to pick about Korea, yes they may be facts but where does one draw the line when ones life seem to revolve around researching and gathering ONLY negative information about Korea? Smell some hate there?

    I do find it fascinating how this hobby became so obsessed,
    There has to be a cause for this spitefulness, please do explain ☺
    Funny how you refer me to Godwin’s law as I don’t believe anything I’ve mentioned is exaggerated in comparison.

    The idea of someone saying ‘Arabs are a terrorist’ is just as much of a racist generalization as you suggesting ‘calling corea backward is appropriate. Backwards, refers to backwards corean culture practices like wifebeating and dogeating.’ Yet again have the audacity to try to rationalize your disgusting generalizations.

    What I find sad is you are extremely DELLUSIONAL.
    Everything you claim you hate about Koreans you are practicing your self. What difference does it make of you when you condemn an entire nation for their ‘chauvinistic anger’ when you obviously cannot handle it yourself. Or suggesting all Koreans gets caught up so emotionally when you are a victim yourself by constantly suggesting radical beliefs purely to enjoy being emotionally caught up in it as well.
    You are a spiteful pretentious being so caught up in your delusional world where no one could ever challenge your obviously offensive statements.
    Isn’t that also your basis of your reasoning behind hating the ‘coreans?’ As often they are so nationalistic and caught up in their own version of the truth that they cannot look outside the box? Talk about hypocrisy.
    What are you exactly trying to achieve with your preaching? Would you be happy if there was genocide in the Korean culture and the race completely vanished in history?
    So it seems you are spiteful of Koreans for they have been spiteful towards Americans and Japanese, what difference does it make for you to continue the cycle? Have you ever thought of that? DO you realize anybody with the right mind regardless of their ethnicity would believe you are preaching hate at a dangerous level regardless of they are factual information or not? This wouldn’t be such a problem if you weren’t so obsessed about just korea and just their negative factual news, which one could do the same with any other country, if one was that obsessed about bringing down another culture.

    For example, there are evidential facts to suggest that there is a large group of Black American imprisonment than of any other ethnic groups currently in the States. (I cant be bothered finding exact back up but I hope this is a general knowledge as much as dog eating is)
    That may be a fact but imagine if a White person on the net decided to dedicate an entire website of analyzing every single other negative facts about Black Americans. Is it ethical to then suggest ‘calling Black Americans backward is appropriate. Backwards, refers to backwards black american culture practices like wifebeating and robbery and getting themselves locked up,’ based on this fact that there’s a higher ratio of Black American prisoners? NO. Is that racist? YES. Do you see the logic here? This is a question of morals and ethics rather than facts. I seriously think you are so STAPLED TO YOUR EGOCENTRIC LUDCIROUS CLAIMS that your mind would never let anyone elses opinion ever convince you. Do you not realise generalizing a group by their ETHNICITY and then DISCRIMINATING them for their ETHNICITY is considered RACIST?

    Again I repeat, I highly dobut you are so avant-garde with your thinking that that the rest of humanity has difficulty in grasping you logic. This goes for the website as well. Do yourself a favour and please turn this into an academic research finding, there’s definitely enough substantial research here to publish an academic book about sociology. Then perhaps your words will hold some weight? Until that academic approval, don’t be so upset of people slandering your research as propagandas. I do fear that this is how most racial hating groups are formed like the KKK. Constantly feeding each other with only the negative aspects about one ethnic group to build hatred towards them is surely considered racist.
    Here’s a defination of racism for you once again.

    rac·ism (rā’sĭz’əm) Pronunciation Key
    n.
    0. The belief that race accounts for differences in human character or ability and that a particular race is superior to others.
    2. Discrimination or prejudice based on race.

    I impose this question for you again, Do you not realise generalizing a group by their ETHNICITY and then DISCRIMINATING them for their ETHNICITY is considered RACIST? You’ve commented that I’m young, yes but obviously this world has unfortunate misguided elders like you with a delusional mind that cannot grasp the SIMPLE concept of RACISM that is taught at a primary school level.

    As you can see, none of my arguments are ‘childish, and shows you have no real arguement’ in fact, you and your constant backing up of ridiculous opinions are the epitome of no real argument and somehow tweaking random wikipedia links could cover up and justify your very obviously racist comments.
    PS: do you not know that wikipedia isn’t an approved source of academic evidential backing?
    I hope you read everything I’ve written there, don’t skim through it.
    Also please do take up my suggestions, and then you may see who’s the problematic one in this argument.

    This includes printing out of all your racist remarks and asking non Occidentalism members’ opinion on whether these statements are racist or not.
    As well as if you ever want to build up your credibility try getting an approval to publish this as an academic research findings. You might as well go for a PhD research degree in the field of Asian Studies with that spiteful passion of yours. Tell me how that goes. Facing reality can be a tough thing judging by your serious delusional mind but hope it goes well. Good luck.
    Perhaps if you do get your PhD in this area and get it published, maybe like most revolutionaries who’s works have been rejected and slandered for their radical thinking, you will be remembered in history, but until then WAKE UP YOU RACIST.

  165. kjeff Says:

    Jenny,
    I saw that you’re a Korean living in Australia. I was wondering whether it’s true, that most Koreans living in Australia have only been there for less than two years. Appreciate the help…

  166. Jenny Says:

    Gosh why do I need to state the obvious and spoon feed this information word for word for that stubborn dellusional mind of GarlicBreath to grasp.

    Why don’t i pull a GarlicBreath. :p

    Calling Japanese people ugly is appropriate. They are short and stumpy and prone to buck teeth.

    (Sorry Ai and all the other Japanese people, I don’t mean it at all)

    * A beautiful Japanese woman by the name of Ai reads this and my thousands of anti Japanese discrimations on the site and rants for hours condemning me of my obviously misguided offensive racist remarks. *

    me – WOW Good Grief, Ai, you sure are ranting. PHEW…. you feel better now?
    .
    good. Breath in … relax.. calm down..so much anger for somebody who is so young…
    .
    If you want to discuss issues, pleases lets do so.
    .
    I expect you to support your claims too. Calling me a racist because you disagree with me is childish, and shows you have no real arguement. If I am racist, please prove that, or at least provide evidence. Citing another co-ethnic nationalist who yells racism as proof is not acceptable. .
    __________________

    Oh the logic. :(

  167. Jenny Says:

    hehe kjeff like with all the generalisations this site loves to make and then turns their back around with random wikipedia back ups thinking that can somehow dilute the original racist remarks, no.

    I myself have been here for over 12 years and know plenty that were BORN here, are second or third generation Australians.

    I do find it sad that such site like this exist and is ashamed of it as an Australian. (My passport says so)

    We are meant to encourage multiculturalism, and by law cannot be discriminating another race for their beliefs and culture, which somehow is dismissed on this website. This site is a living oxymoron.

  168. Matt Says:

    Just to be clear, most of these guys, the cockblocking ones that you generalized as “Korean men” earlier, are only those Koreans who have been in Australia for less than one or two years…OR, most Korean men in Australia(or, Sydney) have only been there for less than one or two years?

    kjeff, here is what I wrote again -

    Most of these guys have only been in Australia for less than one or two years, have grown up in Korea where they are members of the dominant race, and are entirely unassociated with the American controversies you have cited.

    In this case “these guys” means the ones that are saying things like that in my OP, and if I am talking about people here “less than one or two years”, then I am talking about foreign students and working holiday makers, who I have mentioned previously on this thread.

    Remember, I live in the CBD, so most of the people I come across are not suburban kyopo.

    Even so, I think most of the Korean immigrants in Australia are relatively recent, within the last 20 years, and I would say it is fair to say that the majority of “Korean-Australians” are born overseas.

    I remember that Korea-town (Strathfield) in Sydney used to have hardly any Koreans at all. In 1991, a crazed gunman started mowing people down at the shopping mall, and out of the 7 people killed in the massacre, only one of them was Korean. If that happened today, every single person killed would be Korean.

  169. Matt Says:

    I do find it sad that such site like this exist and is ashamed of it as an Australian. (My passport says so)

    We are meant to encourage multiculturalism, and by law cannot be discriminating another race for their beliefs and culture, which somehow is dismissed on this website. This site is a living oxymoron.

    As far as I know there is no law on the books in this country that forces people to push a one sided version of multiculturalism. Multicultural to me means that Koreans and Kyopo are going to be exposed to the questioning of their supremacist power structure just like the average Australian is all the time. Fair?

  170. BananaBoi Says:

    We are meant to encourage multiculturalism, and by law cannot be discriminating another race for their beliefs and culture, which somehow is dismissed on this website. This site is a living oxymoron.

    Jenny, if you have read the Thanks Oppa topic, you should already know, We (Australians) are trying to promote multiculturalism and getting a better understanding of other cultures. But “some” Koreans don’t want to mingle with Australians and segregating themselves from Australians and going to the extent of forcing Korean girls to stay away from Australian guys and calling them whores if seen talking to an Australian guy. Now who is the one being a racist?

  171. kjeff Says:

    Matt,

    In this case “these guys” means the ones that are saying things like that in my OP, and if I am talking about people here “less than one or two years”, then I am talking about foreign students and working holiday makers, who I have mentioned previously on this thread.

    A bit confusing since “these guys” and “less than one or two years” are actually in the same sentence…
    .
    Are you saying when you wrote “Koreans,” “Korean immigrants,” “Korean men” in your OP, you meant the thousands foreign students and holiday makers who have been in Australia for less than 2 years, who lived or are living in CBD, and whom you’ve met… most of them anyways?

  172. Jenny Says:

    Where have I suggested in anyways that what these certain attitude of Korean men are right? No I don’t believe it’s right of them to be so protective of their race, but xenophobia happens in other countries as well not just in Korea, so why point the fingers just at Koreans? How many Arabs are willing to let their daughter marry an Asian man? Heck, even with the White race there are some people that aren’t so fond of ruining their ‘pure blood’ of whiteness with mixing other ethnicities. What I’m suggesting is yes its a wrongful thing to do but it happens in any other race.

    That multi culturalism comment is in relation to my other 2 very long condemning of GarlicBreath and his general racist remarks, and lack of tolerance for the Korean people, not to do with this article ‘Thanks Oppa.’

    Please read those and tell me your stance on generalised race emphasised comments that OnionBreath loves to make.

  173. Brian Says:

    lol. Right on Jenny. I find this site amusing, but to me it does nothing about my impression of Korean people. Japanese, on the other hand, *tsk tsk*.

    I think many readers, or people who have any intellectual capacity, see it the same way.

  174. Brian Says:

    We all know that this is a site of hypocrisy to the extend of racism. People pointing fingers at others for simply being human. Matt is no exception. It’s laughable to the point where I wonder why level headed people like Kjeff even bother.

  175. Jenny Says:

    Brian I just am scared to think this misguided racial hate is happening right now in the country that I call home. The original intention of the website was for a healthy debate but it is unfortunately spoilt by ignorant yet opinionated misguided racists that doesn’t even feel any remorse or guilt of their constant highly offensive generalisations.
    No don’t even hate the Japanese, that’s going down on their level of intelligence by doing so. Remember these people are minorities like the way most of the Koreans they are picking on are minorities. Unfortunately they aren’t bright enough to see the hypocrisy behind their constant anti Korea bashing.

    I’ve come to a conclusion that the entire site’s existence has been spoilt by a living contradiction. So they condemn the Koreans for being spitefulness against the Japanese and Americans, and what do they do in reaction to that? They do the same in return with their replies. Great work guys.

  176. GarlicBreath Says:

    Jenny

    yes I am Korean living in Australia

    and now:

    as an Australian. (My passport says so)

    It sounds like you are Corean first, and only a paper citizen of Australia. Lucky for the USA and Japan that Australia. There are enough corean paper citizens in those great nations.

    coreans in Indonesia like those in the article are filthy animals.’

    This was in regard to corean child rapists going to Bali to rape children. If you approve of Coreans doing that, or disagree that they are filty animals, then say so. Answer clearly if you think I am wrong here.

    “Calling corea backward is appropriate. Backwards, refers to backwards corean culture practices like wifebeating and dogeating.”

    Yes, I have said it many times that wife beating and dog eating is barbaric. I stand by it. I do not suggest that every single Corean man beats woman while eating dog 24/7. Why should I have to put a disclaimer on a statement that is meant to discribe a cultural practice, and that it may not apply to all living and dead coreans 24/7.

    “Coreans do take great offence when anybody challenges their chauvinistic and corea-centric view of the world”

    I am talking about people like you here. I stand by this statment.

    ‘Typical arrogance from a blind nationalist coreans.’

    This is getting tiresome, but yes I find blind nationalism of Coreans sick and wrong. I am opposed to any kind of blind nationalism.

    ‘Yes he is dishonest. Its odd that real coreans would never EVER accept him as corean, yet on the internet he is a corean nationalist.

    This was in regard to corean racism twards “mixed bloods” and a troll that can be found here.

    ‘(strange how Corean whores surrond the world, yet there were none during wwII)’

    Yes corean prostitution is widespread. Do you disagree? Yet, coreans claim that the whores that worked for the Corean pimps were not whores. Do you dispute that?

    ‘Corean product are only going to be around for a few more years. China will gobble up the low end market and the cheep corean garbage will be replaced with chinese products. Good bye SamDung.’

    Do I have to like Samdung because you do? I find corean products cheep and China will make the same products for cheeper? How is that racist? Are not chinese and coreans the same race? Answer that Jenny.

    ‘Corea owes a lot to Japan. Coreans have no idea about their own history. Its a shame they hate japan so much, yet owe so much to the kind Japanese people.’

    Yes, what is the problem? Japanese are kind? I guess I should say that some coreans know history? Where is the racism?
    .
    Jenny, you are a huge waste of time.
    .
    I am sure your ranting will get a few nods of agreement from the usual group of Corean nationalists. Good for you.

    .
    PS this is a lie.

    somehow tweaking random wikipedia links could cover up and justify your very obviously racist comments

    I didnt tweak Wikipedia. I just posted a link. I dont edit wikipedia for nationalist reasons. Tigg, was cited as a nationalist corean by ohmynews does that. Your logic that I used godwin’s law to “justify racism” is wacky. I didn’t use wikipedia as a academic source either, but to provide the reader with some backround to understand what the refrence meant.
    .
    Jenny, come back when you have had some time to grow up. I am dissapointed with the younger generation of coreans (not all jenny, dont blow your top). So angry and so full of bitter resentment.

  177. GarlicBreath Says:

    I wrote:

    I am sure your ranting will get a few nods of agreement from the usual group of Corean nationalists. Good for you.

    And here is old Blian.

    Brian Says:

    October 31st, 2007 at 11:53 pm
    lol. Right on Jenny. I find this site amusing, but to me it does nothing about my impression of Korean people. Japanese, on the other hand, *tsk tsk*.

    Blian do you mean ALL Japanese? LOL. hypocrats.
    .
    Jenny, face it, not all people around the world worship corea the way you and other nationalists do. I want to help educate people about real corean culture. That is all.

  178. Jenny Says:

    OMG you’ve compleltey missed my point ONCE AGAIN.
    DID YOU EVEN BOTHER TO READ WHAT I WROTE?

    DEFINITION OF RACISM FOR THE 3RD TIME FOR YOUR DELLUSIONAL MIND TO UNDERSTAND:

    rac·ism (rā’sĭz’əm) Pronunciation Key
    n.
    0. The belief that race accounts for differences in human character or ability and that a particular race is superior to others.
    2. Discrimination or prejudice based on race.

    COMPARE YOUR QUOTES TO THAT DEFINITION AND GO FIGURE.

    Paper citizen? I am just as PROUD OF AUSTRALIA and much as i’m proud of KOREA. I think it’s an EMBARRASSMENT people like you exist in our society. Unfortunately there’s no cure for your delluded mind and metallic barricate of ego.

    ‘Yes, what is the problem? Japanese are kind? I guess I should say that some coreans know history? Where is the racism?’

    HOW THE HELL SOMEONE IN THE RIGHT MIND CAN MAKE SUCH GENERALISATION OF AN ENTIRE NATION CONSISTING OF MILLIONS OF PEOPLE LIKE THAT?

    ARE YOU EVEN EDUCATED? I HIGHLY FEAR YOU ARE.
    DO YOU NOT REALISE WHAT A HYPOCRITE YOU ARE FOR ALL THIS HATE?

    ‘“Coreans do take great offence when anybody challenges their chauvinistic and corea-centric view of the world”’

    well surely YOU ARENT KOREAN but you are taking an OFFENCE whenever someone challenges your RIDICULOUSLY LAUGHABLY IGNORANT RACIST VIEW OF THE WORLD.

    See the STUPIDITY BEHIND YOUR IGNORANCE?

    Like I said NO YOUR THINKING ISN’T REVOLUTIONARY AT ALL and it is PURE RACISM.
    Should you STILL HAVE THE DIFFICULTY OF UNDERSTANDING THIS, TRY A SECOND OPINON. Take a PRINT OUT OF YOUR RACIST REMARKS AND SHOW IT TO ANYONE WITH HALF A BRAIN AND SEE WHAT THEY SAY.
    Show it to your SHRINK.

    Now I’m off to eat my sushi. I seriously pity you that live everyday in such pessimism and holding a grudge against a nation.

    Also why are avoding all my questions? I would love to hear the answers.

  179. Jenny Says:

    No i dont expect everyone around the world to worship korea but your racist ignorant mind bothers me.
    STICK TO YOUR OWN WORDS.
    ““Calling corea backward is appropriate. Backwards, refers to backwards corean culture practices like wifebeating and dogeating.”
    WHERE IN THAT SENTENCE DO YOU ACKNOWLEDGE THAT IT’S NOT EVERY COREAN THATS EATING DOGS AND BEATING WIFES?

    See how you are GENERALISING? Which ties with the definition of racism 2. Discrimination or prejudice based on race.
    How much more do I need to spoon feed these obvious facts that you refuse to see?

    Also you’ve claimed “Coreans do take great offence when anybody challenges their chauvinistic and corea-centric view of the world”
    Well AGAIN ENOUGH OF THE GENERALISATION. (Clearly you’ve missed some vital education in your life and is run by overt misguided opinions which is ironic)
    Aren’t you a VICTIM yourself for spending your day to day basis holding GRUDGE against an ethnic group each day yet you have the AUDACITY point fingers at minor Koreans doing the same?

    I’d hate to see what kind of person you are in real life. You are in no better position than Korean extremists that promotes racism. YOU ARE DOING JUST THE SAME WITH YOUR HYPOCRITICAL IGNORANCE AND IS UNAWARE OF IT.

    Being in denial doesn’t solve ANYTHING.

  180. Jenny Says:

    also you suggest everyone that’s offended by your biased opinon a NATIONALIST? me a NATIONALIST? of which country? I’m now an AUSTRALIAN.
    what person in the right mind would accept all your LUDCIROUS GENERALISATIONS?
    .
    Aren’t you a VICTIM of JAPANESE NATIONALISM yourself with your sheer CONDOSCENDING ATTITUDE YOU CARRY IN YOUR SPEECH? As if Koreans are an INFERIOR race in comparison to the Japanese?
    which AGAIN is an EVIDENCE of your racism as it co incides with this definition: “Racism – The belief that race accounts for differences in human character or ability and that a particular race is superior to others.”
    .
    Yet you WONDER why people that belong to your degraded race finds it OFFENSIVE? Are they acting of nationalism? NO. It’s rather SELF DEFENSE and correcting of SHEER STUPIDITY LIKE YOURS.
    .
    Do you realise you are the one that’s constant trying to TIE EVERYTHING WITH AN EMPHASIS ON SOMEONE’S RACE AS A FACTOR BEHIND ALL THE NEGATIVE ACTIONS?
    “Coreans do take great offence when anybody challenges their chauvinistic and corea-centric view of the world”
    .
    Coreans this Coreans that, why the EMPHASIS ON THE RACE? DO YOU REALISE THAT’S THE EPITOME OF RACISM IN THIS WORLD WE LIVE IN?
    .
    I may be younger than you but FORTUNATELY i’ve been educated enough to not be a victim of this RACIST CYCLE. Shame on you!
    SHEER STUPIDITY I MUST SAY.

  181. General Tiger Says:

    You know, it’s funny that we’re still putting up with Garlic, when we have all the time to talk with rational people like Matt.

  182. Jenny Says:

    If this site was a social justice site as it should have been, the owner should be condemning this congregation of racists that breed racism. They need to be banned from spreading such hatred towards an ethic group purely because of their RACE.

  183. Jenny Says:

    Now that I re read the article ‘Thanks, Oppa.’ I have to also make note of the authors generalisations as well. It’s hard to take the article seriously when you make ignorant generalisations like “EVERY single Korean girl is told exactly the same thing.’
    Im a Korean Australian, no I’ve never been told that my entire life. Does that make me an alien?
    .
    What’s with this sites’ obsession of emphasising someone’s race as an account for an individuals wrongful actions? Surely someone with an educated mind shouldn’t be making such streotyped statements.
    .
    IT”S NOT ROCKET SCIENCE THAT EMPHASISING SOMEONE’S RACE AS THE REASON FOR THEIR WRONGFUL ACTIONS IS CONSIDERED RACIST.
    .
    I’m Australian as well, so would it be fair for someone to streotype me as the “Australian that hates the Arabic race like they did in Cronulla?’ I don’t think so.
    .
    Be sensitive with emphasising someone’s race instead of condemning that individual’s wrong actions regardless of their ethnic background.

  184. chase Says:

    Jenny, don’t worry about Garlicbreath generalizing Korea in his comments. As he stated above, he usually means “Most” or “Substantial amount” of Koreans. I think you aren’t, but many commentors are generaliziing Japanese and Chinese, too.

    rac·ism (rā’sĭz’əm) Pronunciation Key
    n.
    0. The belief that race accounts for differences in human character or ability and that a particular race is superior to others.
    2. Discrimination or prejudice based on race

    That definition probably wouldn’t satisfy Garlicbreath’s understanding because he thinks “race” as a big group rather than eath nation race. ex) East Asian, Indian, Africans, Caucasians, Middle Eastern, Native Ameircan etc…
    so if you say something like (sorry, this might not be your statement) you are putting down Koreans and praising Japanese only!! , his reaction will be ‘why is that racism?? both Japanese and Korean are East Asians”
    However, “race” also means “an ethnic group” and “people” of one “nation.” so you are right. Garlicbreath’s comments seem racist.

    Coreans this Coreans that, why the EMPHASIS ON THE RACE? DO YOU REALISE THAT’S THE EPITOME OF RACISM IN THIS WORLD WE LIVE IN?

    Yes, we live in a racist world. Most of people have some degree of racist and prejudiced mind. The users of this blog should be prejudiced too. However, they are probably not much more racist than you or I am. If they are truly racist, they will blame something about Korean genetic which racist Hitler had in mind, or most of people of this world are biased about. (although I must say that Garlicbreath really do have some racist comments, but I think it’s just exaggerated and meant to be funny and shocking) Their criticism are about some faces of Korean culture.

    now.. I don’t mean that things Garlicbreath and other people who are criticizing Korea are necessarily right. But I found that their criticism are logical and persuasive. garlicbreath just tends to use over-harsh language.

    also you suggest everyone that’s offended by your biased opinon a NATIONALIST? me a NATIONALIST? of which country? I’m now an AUSTRALIAN.

    Yeah you are Australian. But, isn’t it true that you have more interest, knowledge, or love toward Korea than an average Australian has? Just the face that you are an Australian won’t say that you wouldn’t have any bias about Korea.

    I’ve noticed that a lot of people are commenting stuff like “you don’t have a right to blame that because you are too ~~~like that”. but if this rule would completely apply, no one in this world can criticize anyone. If A does a bad thing and B does the same thing and blames A, B is wrong but A is wrong too, and they both should be fixed.

  185. chase Says:

    Now that I re read the article ‘Thanks, Oppa.’ I have to also make note of the authors generalisations as well. It’s hard to take the article seriously when you make ignorant generalisations like “EVERY single Korean girl is told exactly the same thing.’
    Im a Korean Australian, no I’ve never been told that my entire life. Does that make me an alien?
    .

    I’ve never experience that either. but when I think about Korean culture and MY attitude, it’s not unrealistic. I consider that I try to be not prejudiced or racist but I still do feel uneasy whenever I read something like “the rate of Korean-foreigner marriage are increasing” “Korean government decided to grant/pass law favorable to foreign immigrants” , somewhere in my mind, I have a high pride being ethnic-Korean, and happy about that all koreans share the same ethnic background/culture and it always has been that way ~~~~~~~ etc. In Korean culture, there is a pride about Koreans being all ethnic Koreans, sharing the same values and cultures. Koreans value that so much that they are always afriad of losing them. but another thing strange is that although they are afraid of breakup of homogeniousity, each individual is fine with oneself breaking the rule.

  186. GarlicBreath Says:

    “jenny” has totally lost it. HWA-BYUNG.
    .

    Coreans this Coreans that, why the EMPHASIS ON THE RACE? DO YOU REALISE THAT’S THE EPITOME OF RACISM IN THIS WORLD WE LIVE IN?

    Jenny, I talk about coreans in the hopes of educating people on the real culture of corea. Some coreans sit around and talk about how corea is the center of the universe. Do you have the same rage for them. I don’t think you do. You are a hypocrat.

    Hi Chase,

    However, “race” also means “an ethnic group” and “people” of one “nation.” so you are right.

    I am not so sure you are right about what “jenny” means by race. I assumed that Jenny is the type of corean nationalist who thinks that Coreans are their own race. I disagree with this notion. I belive, that coreans are a mix of chinese tribes. Nevertheless, to many nationalist coreans their blood is so pure that they are their own race. Thus, questioning corean greatness is “racism” to them.

  187. GarlicBreath Says:

    “jenny” has totally lost it. HWA-BYUNG.
    .

    Coreans this Coreans that, why the EMPHASIS ON THE RACE? DO YOU REALISE THAT’S THE EPITOME OF RACISM IN THIS WORLD WE LIVE IN?

    Jenny, I talk about coreans in the hopes of educating people on the real culture of corea. Some coreans sit around and talk about how corea is the center of the universe. Do you have the same rage for them. I don’t think you do. You are a hypocrat.

    Hi Chase,

    However, “race” also means “an ethnic group” and “people” of one “nation.” so you are right.

    I am not so sure you are right about what “jenny” means by race. I assumed that Jenny is the type of corean nationalist who thinks that Coreans are their own race. I disagree with this notion. I belive, that coreans are a mix of chinese tribes. Nevertheless, to many nationalist coreans their blood is so pure that they are their own race. Thus, questioning corean greatness is “racism” to them.

  188. GarlicBreath Says:

    I have a high pride being ethnic-Korean, and happy about that all koreans share the same ethnic background/culture and it always has been that way ~~~~~~~ etc. In Korean culture, there is a pride about Koreans being all ethnic Koreans, sharing the same values and cultures.

    Good for you Chase. I agree that coreans feel that way, but arn’t you makeing a generalization?
    What did Jenny say? Oh ya, she said she was a hypocrite. She said that generalizing about corea is great if its positive (truth be dammed) but saying anything that is negative, even if its true, is racist.

    Coreans this Coreans that, why the EMPHASIS ON THE RACE? DO YOU REALISE THAT’S THE EPITOME OF RACISM IN THIS WORLD WE LIVE IN?

    Jenny, why do you discuss your race? You first claimed to be corean, and Australian is your passport. now you claim:

    I’m now an AUSTRALIAN.

    paper citizen and a corean nationalist.

  189. chase Says:

    I assumed that Jenny is the type of corean nationalist who thinks that Coreans are their own race. I disagree with this notion. I belive, that coreans are a mix of chinese tribes. Nevertheless, to many nationalist coreans their blood is so pure that they are their own race. Thus, questioning corean greatness is “racism” to them.

    You are right about Koreans sharing genes with Chinese and Japanese. I consider Korean as a small ethnic-subgroup of East Asian race.
    Appereancewise);; There are many Chinese or Japanese people who look like average Korean face but average Chinese and Japanese people don’t really look like Korean. for example, Koreans have lower rate of having “double eye-lid”… ex) This can be a coincidence, but at our school, 3/10 Koreans don’t have double-eye lid while all ethnic-Chinese(and Taiwanese) have it and only one half Chinese half Japanese girl don’t have it.
    These are small distinctions but since Korea is relatively small these distinctions look big to them. I can be biased but whenever I see Asian people, I feel like I can tell whether they are Korean or Japanese even if they are completely assimilated into American fashion.(Chinese is harder because as the country is big, there are bigger variance)
    Culturally)) Korean culture was largely adapted from China to start with and has been deeply influenced by or (maybe) influenced other neighboring countreis, so there are similarities. However, they have been different coutries which leads to now so Korea has distinction of its own. ex) hanbok kimono qipao

    I think everyone perceives the word “race” differently. To me race has two meanings. race by skin color, and race by each nation(American would be multifacial in this case)
    Yeah, considering Korean race as “pure” is wrong. It’s not but it’s in smaller scope. and being proud of that smaller scope is part of Korean culture which is racist.

  190. chase Says:

    Of those I heard, they’re usually came from parents worrying about their girls(still refusing to believe that Korean-Korean couples do have sex before marriage).

    It’s not just about the culture of having sex before marriage. They want you to keep have Korean values that they had. My dad said that although he’s not going to force me, he really wants me to marry a ethnic Korean man especially who speak Korean fluently. Otherwise at least some of my realitves will disapprove me and some people will look down on me unless the person is a really really great person….and believe me, my dad is very well respected and known to be fair.. My mom worries about the same thing but much less than my dad.

  191. Jenny Says:

    Why does historical ancestry of the korean race matter in this situation? You are purely using it to divert the issue from the main point of the argument here. You are STILL trying to find loop holes to run away from the OBVIOUS FACT THAT YOU ARE USING GENERALISED IDEALS TO CONDEMN AN ENTIRE NATION.
    That you LOVE to emphasis one’s ethnicity as the CAUSE OF THEIR WRONGFUL INDIVIDUAL CHARACTERISTICS.
    Why do you hold such grudge towards Koreans from the first place anyway? Does this help you to feel better about yourself? By promoting reverse racism do you honestly think it’s solving any of your personal concerns of SOME Korean extremists that promote racism? My logic tells me no, it will just WORSEN it.
    .
    So your justification for your constant uncalled for Korean bashing is a retaliation as ‘Some coreans sit around and talk about how corea is the center of the universe.’
    So you choose to be just like them and encourage favouring of your nation in order to bring down these inflated Koreans down to reality?
    .
    How very intelligent of you.
    .
    Stop trying to rationalise your racist beliefs, it’s disgusting and learn from your mistakes, don’t be an hypocrite. At this rate you aren’t any better than any of these reports of racist koreans if you cannot acknowledge your own faults. I’ve been suggesting this all through out my comments, thus implying that I also don’t favour racist actions from Koreans either, so I dont know where you get this whole nationalist rubbish of an excuse from.

  192. Errol Says:

    chase Says:
    November 1st, 2007 at 3:28 am

    My dad said that although he’s not going to force me, he really wants me to marry a ethnic Korean man especially who speak Korean fluently. Otherwise at least some of my realitves will disapprove me and some people will look down on me unless the person is a really really great person

    I’ve had this discussion several times with Australians who perceive Koreans as racist. Then I tell them, “If Ward Hines was to walk through the door every aboji and ajumonni would say, You go girl! Marry that dude!

    Of course that was after Ward Hines won an MVP at the Superbowl.

    But after the game, when the kids went out to eat, the person who put together the event only took the Korean kids, leaving Hines behind (Ward is of mixed parentage, his father an African-American). After that I told Hines to never hang out with Korean kids. Yet when we went to Korea in ’98, even Korean people who looked educated spat when we walked by. Koreans judge others based on their appearance and their age. Those kinds of Koreans think that they are so special…”

  193. justice Says:

    Upon discovering this site i am truly shocked about the level of racism, and worse still, the dillusion of its defense. Garlic breath says “I talk about coreans in the hopes of educating people on the real culture of corea.” I just love the way he refers to his negatively biased version of corean culture as the “REAL culture of corea.” If you focus so intently on every negative aspect of this culture you can find are you then surprised that the end result is also negetive?

    The manner in which you criticize corea and coreans can be applied to any nation or rather anyTHING with the end result being the same. You actively generalize negetively about coreans and then claim it’s not racism because they are by your definition not a race at all? Regardless it is still DISCRIMINATION, generalized against a group of people, which is equally unacceptable… or is that ok in your book?

    Constantly you will make remarks such as “Calling corea backward is appropriate. Backwards, refers to backwards corean culture practices like wifebeating and dogeating.” or “(strange how Corean whores surrond the world, yet there were none during wwII),” but these are by your definition not racist or discriminatory because they are “factual,” well they are JUST as FACTUAL everywhere else they occur, and no one is defending these practices, corean or otherwise. they are equally bad regardless of location. Might i also add the second of those two quotations of yours is quite disgusting imo, it almost sounds as if you are trying to justify the rape of innocent women? (yes im sure some were prostitutes but the majority most certainly werent.

    Now before you even say it i am not a corean by blood or otherwise, however i am knowledgeable about the culture and i have traveled there and found nothing but kindness and acceptances, WHICH IS MORE THAN I CAN SEE COMING FROM HERE.

    Jenny seems to be the most level headed here so i’ll leave you with a quote from her i particularily loved.
    “You are in no better position than Korean extremists that promotes racism. YOU ARE DOING JUST THE SAME WITH YOUR HYPOCRITICAL IGNORANC”
    She is exactly right, you are no better than the corean extremists you actively condemn.

  194. Jenny Says:

    “What did Jenny say? Oh ya, she said she was a hypocrite. She said that generalizing about corea is great if its positive (truth be dammed) but saying anything that is negative, even if its true, is racist.”
    .
    Please pin point out to me the cold hard facts where I’ve displayed this. :) you LOVE facts dont you? why make an assumption like this? you are obviously STILL GENERALISING. So you expect me to have this attitude purely because I have a Korean blood in me?
    .
    Notice how racist and ignorant that sounds?
    .
    Haven’t you noticed I’ve been acknowledging of these Korean extremists as well? So where does my bias/hypocricy come into play?

  195. Errol Says:

    justice Says:
    November 1st, 2007 at 4:08 am

    i am knowledgeable about (Korean) culture and i have traveled there and found nothing but kindness and acceptances,

    That’s right! You are so knowledgeable. You know more about Korea than the mothers of a biracial children in Korea.


    “If I had the opportunity to get out of Korea right now, I would do it without a moment’s hesitation,” An said. Kim silently held her hand. Then she said, “Yes, that is what you should do. I always used to think that too.”

  196. General Tiger Says:

    chase:

    Yeah, considering Korean race as “pure” is wrong. It’s not but it’s in smaller scope. and being proud of that smaller scope is part of Korean culture which is racist.

    Wait, are you saying being proud of being a Korean is racist, or having pride in the “purity” of Koreans is racist? Just trying to understand what you’re saying.
    .
    Errol:

    That’s right! You are so knowledgeable. You know more about Korea than the mothers of a biracial children in Korea.

    I guess you’re using an article to say that “every” non-Korean wives want to leave Korea?

  197. Errol Says:

    # General Tiger Says:
    November 1st, 2007 at 4:25 am

    I guess you’re using an article to say that “every” non-Korean wives want to leave Korea?

    I’m providing a web-linked article to back up numerous personal anecdotes of my friends’ wives.

  198. Errol Says:

    My apologies General. Either you’ve misunderstood the article or I’ve misunderstood your post. “Every” non-Korean wives would be the ones from Vietnam, Philippines, Kiribati etc. The widespread availability of sex-screening technology for pregnant women since the 1980s has resulted in the birth of a disproportionate number of South Korean males.

    The article, and I, were referring to Korean wives of non-Koreans.

  199. justice Says:

    That’s right! You are so knowledgeable. You know more about Korea than the mothers of a biracial children in Korea.

    “If I had the opportunity to get out of Korea right now, I would do it without a moment’s hesitation,” An said. Kim silently held her hand. Then she said, “Yes, that is what you should do. I always used to think that too.”

    Firstly i was by no means claiming to be the ultimate authority on corean culture, i was just simply saying i do know something about it.
    Secondly your justification is yet ANOTHER generalization, implying based solely on one article that everyone corean mother of a biracial child wants to leave the country. How ironic of you to continue to generalize while challenging the justification for my argument that you are generalizing.

    and most importantly, in specifically targeting such an irrelevant point from my argument overall, you completely ignore all the other far more important points. I assume this is because you have no defense, right?

  200. Matt Says:

    That multi culturalism comment is in relation to my other 2 very long condemning of GarlicBreath and his general racist remarks, and lack of tolerance for the Korean people, not to do with this article ‘Thanks Oppa.’

    Really? Seemed like you were talking about this site to me. Lets look at what you wrote (emphasis mine) -

    I do find it sad that such site like this exist and is ashamed of it as an Australian. (My passport says so)

    We are meant to encourage multiculturalism, and by law cannot be discriminating another race for their beliefs and culture, which somehow is dismissed on this website. This site is a living oxymoron.

    It seems to me you are talking about this site, not GarlicBreath.

    Please read those and tell me your stance on generalised race emphasised comments that OnionBreath loves to make.

    I don’t even read his comments. However, I offered kjeff to ban him if he felt offended by the comments. Personally, the comments I have read from GarlicBreath simply tell me he is someone that cannot articulate his thoughts so well. On some of the occasions I have read his comments, ofttimes I did not agree with him. Nor do I agree with you. He is just a commenter here, just like you, not a representative of the site at large. To the extent that you interact with him, that is your choice.

    Now that I re read the article ‘Thanks, Oppa.’ I have to also make note of the authors generalisations as well. It’s hard to take the article seriously when you make ignorant generalisations like “EVERY single Korean girl is told exactly the same thing.’
    Im a Korean Australian, no I’ve never been told that my entire life. Does that make me an alien?

    Well, I find that fascinating. You have really never experienced this or come across it, and you associate with Korean people frequently? Perhaps what is needed is some sort of impetus, like associating with a white male.

    You know it is rather a common thing. Put a post up on hojunara for a language exchange, and get blasted with hate mail, for example.

  201. Errol Says:

    justice Says:
    November 1st, 2007 at 4:46 am

    Secondly your justification is yet ANOTHER generalization, implying based

    solely

    on one article that everyone corean mother of a biracial child wants to leave the country. How ironic of you to continue to generalize while challenging the justification for my argument that you are generalizing.

    Solely? General Tiger was the first to reach the strategic point here. To which I replied:

    # Errol Says:
    November 1st, 2007 at 4:31 am

    I’m providing a web-linked article to back up numerous personal anecdotes of my friends’ wives.

    Then to deal with the latest post. I’m calling jenny’ bluff.

    Matt Says:
    November 1st, 2007 at 4:47 am

    Now that I re read the article ‘Thanks, Oppa.’ I have to also make note of the authors generalisations as well. It’s hard to take the article seriously when you make ignorant generalisations like “EVERY single Korean girl is told exactly the same thing.’
    Im a Korean Australian, no I’ve never been told that my entire life. Does that make me an alien?

    Jenny should take the “The familyguy Challenge”: Walk around Darling Harbour on a Sunday afternoon with familyguy. Doesn’t have to hold hands or anything. Within 24 hours how many phonecalls will jenny get from disgruntled Korean punters? “Yo! What u doin’ with that white boy? He’s a playa! I’m a warnen’ uu!”

    If jenny backs down is she than admitting that Australian blokes are as described by dear old oppa?

  202. justice Says:

    Since when are these vaguely referred to “anecdotes,” which you haven’t even detailed considered evidence for an argument? I stand by my point. And again HOW IRRELEVANT…i challenge you to take on one of my other points which actually hold bearing on the issue at hand.

  203. Jenny Says:

    Read points 182, 183. I’ve outline why i feel the site also has some racist undertones.

    So you don’t agree with me.
    Am I reaching for the stars here? Am I asking for a ground breaking new knowledge that one shouldn’t generalise an ethnicity by the actions of a mionority?
    Is it such a foreign concept that you shouldn’t emphasise one’s ethnicity as the cause of that INDIVIDUALS wrong doings? Because that’s racial streotyping also known as racism. (dictionary definition: Discrimination or prejudice based on race)
    it’s disgusting and highly offensive to think GarlicBreath has been preaching this sort of hate for over two years (if he had been active like this from the creation of the website) and no actions have been done to condemn it.
    .
    I stand for social justice. I do find it offensive when ignorant people make generalised offensive statements like GarlicBreath has been making. At the same time, I’m not gloryfying these idiotic conservative korean men you’ve unfortunately have apparently encountered so much.
    .
    What I’m suggesting is, by promoting reverse racism it isn’t going to solve anything. At this rate by doing the exact same thing of making prejudice streotyped comments back at an entire nation based on the actions of the minority is equally as bad as these korean offenders that are being reported on the website, thus GarlicBreath is an ultimate hypocrite as he has no right to judge, when he’s equally as racist.
    .
    PS: No i’ve never experienced this around me , and if you are suggesting that I need to hang out more with white people for this sort of reaction to occur, that alone I think is quiet a generalised view on the korean race. Obviously they don’t account for the majority, It’s unforunate that you have encountered horribly ignorant korean men in your life but i can assure you that not every korean is like that (duh), but making making a generalised assumption of an entire nation based upon this, I dont believe is the way to go about it.
    .
    There’s good and bad of every nation of every colour (duh) and of course I’ve encountered a certain ethnic group ie: the Lebanese that have been rather abrupt in their nature but I’m intelligent enough to not make a generalised racist conclusion that ‘Lebanese men are violent terrorits.’

    To sum it up, by making racial generalisations, you are playing on their level of morality, thus you aren’t any better than them.

  204. Errol Says:

    What point? I was responding to chase’s cogent point on her father’s concerns about mixing with non-Koreans who aren’t (yet) really really great people …

    The topic is oppa (or aboji) making assumptions about non-Koreans because miscegenation might contain the bad seed. Classic Confucian Lamarckism.

    A topic that chase, to her credit (and her parents’) admitted in public.

    Your points are about GB’s posts. If you expect me to respond to a post you must do either of the following: (1) be on topic. Today’s topic, Overbearing Oppas or, (2) refer to a specific point that I (not GB or some other poster) has made.

    Which leads us to (2). One of my (non-Korean) friends’ (Korean) wives came home in tears one day because a (Korean) mother had said to her (Korean) son, “Don’t go near that child. She’s dirty. Look at her skin.”

    My two female student friends from the USA (Daddy is African-American and mommy is Korean) booted unceremoniously out of the female dormitories within 24 hours of arriving at a famous (irony intended) Korean university because we don’t want no …

    Would you like me to continue?

    Sole article? If you read the article properly it was at the Pearl S. Buck Foundation. Don’t want a girl-child? Abort or send to the USA. Don’t want a mixed race child? Abort or send to the USA.

  205. Jenny Says:

    Just to make this less complicated, my 203 is addressing matt and Garlicbreath, and every other commented on this is addressing GarlicBreath.

  206. Jenny Says:

    * every other comments on this thread is addressing GarlicBreath and my concern for his racist remarks.

  207. Errol Says:

    My post at 204 is referenced to justice’s

    # justice Says:
    November 1st, 2007 at 5:06 am

    Since when are these vaguely referred to “anecdotes,” which you haven’t even detailed considered evidence for an argument? I stand by my point. And again HOW IRRELEVANT…i challenge you to take on one of my other points which actually hold bearing on the issue at hand.

    Not to jenny’s post which is directed at Matt(?). Or maybe I’m being obtuse.

    Anyway to jenny’s post:

    # Jenny Says:
    November 1st, 2007 at 5:20 am

    if you are suggesting that I need to hang out more with white people for this sort of reaction to occur, that alone I think is quiet a generalised view on the korean race.

    Which Matt suggested here:

    Matt Says:
    November 1st, 2007 at 4:47 am

    Perhaps what is needed is some sort of impetus, like associating with a white male.

    My recommendation was:

    Errol Says:
    November 1st, 2007 at 4:55 am

    Jenny should take the “The familyguy Challenge”: Walk around Darling Harbour on a Sunday afternoon with familyguy. Doesn’t have to hold hands or anything. Within 24 hours how many phonecalls will jenny get from disgruntled Korean punters? “Yo! What u doin’ with that white boy? He’s a playa! I’m a warnen’ uu!”

    If jenny backs down is she than admitting that Australian blokes are as described by dear old oppa?

    Hmm. Darling Harbour. Meet a friend you haven’t seen for a year. (I don’t live in Sydney) Go to Darling Harbour and she receives the old “Is he your boyfriend” from barely known (i.e. Not her friend) oppa. My friend didn’t get the full oppa overbearing because I look like I have a lot of money and old oppa needs to keep an eye out potential decent jobs.

    chase’s dad would like me. Or maybe he’d just like my dad’s (and my) money.

  208. justice Says:

    Yes my points were aimed towards Garlicbreath, but YES you did challenge them on a somewhat trivial issue and so YES i do expect if you are to challenge my statements you give a more relevant response.

  209. Jenny Says:

    Ok I just read Errols’ 204th comment.
    .
    I pity you. do you live in such fear and anxiety that every korean in this world is overly xenophobic as you are suggesting here?
    What century do we live in again? Yeh there are accounts of racism blah blah, but how does this actions of an individual minority elevate to an entire nation of 40 point something million koreans? Since when was it such a groundbreaking issue of a multi ethnic relationship in the year 2007??? One famous couple that comes to my mind is Alice Kim and Nicholas Cage, another ones include Amerie, Kimora Lee Simmons, Chanel Iman and that only took me less than 5 seconds to think off my head.
    .
    Again yes it seems there are still some conservative korean men according to this article, but the amount of racist generalised remarks found on this site is equally as bad as these korean offenders that are being reported. Talk about hypocricy.
    .
    And seriously no, I highly doubt in the civilised world that I live in that my parents would have any problem if I went out with someone of another ethnicity, in fact why don’t i list the ethnicity of my closest friends that i hang out with on a daily basis.
    Equadorian, British, Japanese, Chinese, Korean, Vietnamese, Spanish, Polish and Korean.
    .
    All you people hating here really need to get out more and look at the world from a positive aspective, chances are if you focus just on the negative aspects of anything you will live a miserable life. :p
    .
    Seriously i pity GarlicBreath if his daily activity revolves around visiting Occidentalism each day to complain, bitch and moan and make generalised racist remarks everyday. What a sad life that is :(
    .
    I also find it shocking to think that people can resort to uniting in a friendship group in the name of racial hating, how different is that to how KKK was formed? :s

  210. Jenny Says:

    oh sorry i meant to say GarlicBreath not Errol and ignore the 204th coment thing, JUST GARLICBREATH, thanks :D

  211. Errol Says:

    # justice Says:
    November 1st, 2007 at 5:49 am

    Yes my points were aimed towards Garlicbreath, but YES you did challenge them on a somewhat trivial issue and so YES i do expect if you are to challenge my statements you give a more relevant response.

    Trivial issue?

    justice Says:
    November 1st, 2007 at 4:08 am

    i am knowledgeable about (Korean) culture and i have traveled there and found nothing but kindness and acceptances,

    Nothing but … A definitive statement. Y’all don’t have no Black or Indonesian friends then …

    Another anecdote to part with … Caught the subway one night with Australian friend and Indonesian friend. Korean male (singular) enters carriage and begins a rant. Rest of carriage was OK. i.e. Stereotyping the good Koreans (in public anyway as chaemyeon implies avoiding confrontation). “Shut the fuck up”, he screams. Again he yells, “Shut the fuck up. Shut the fuck up. Don’t speak English you dirty foreigners.”

    We exit the carriage and next stop and wait for the next train. My Australian friend says, “Wow! That’s never happened to me before.” Our Indonesian friend looks at us sadly, almost in tears, “That happens to my friends and I ALL the time.”

    During the tirade I apologised to the other (Korean) passengers in Korean that, We knew this was not typical of Korea. He was just a man who’d drunk too much soju.”

    OTOH. Overbearing oppa is, however, typical. Take “The familyguy Challenge” and find out for yourself.

  212. Errol Says:

    Jenny Says:
    November 1st, 2007 at 5:58 am

    Ok I just read Errols’ 204th comment.
    .
    I pity you. do you live in such fear and anxiety that every korean in this world is overly xenophobic as you are suggesting here?

    Bit of a laff that. Even Mr kjeff has worked out that I been around the world a bit. But then you realised it was really for GB.

    # Jenny Says:
    November 1st, 2007 at 6:00 am

    oh sorry i meant to say GarlicBreath not Errol and ignore the 204th coment thing, JUST GARLICBREATH, thanks :D

    Try Darling Habour or the Sydney CBD. As Matt says,

    Matt Says:
    October 31st, 2007 at 11:07 pm
    Most of these guys … have grown up in Korea where they are members of the dominant race.

    In this case “these guys” … I am talking about foreign students and working holiday makers, who I have mentioned previously on this thread.

    Remember, I live in the CBD, so most of the people I come across are not suburban kyopo.

    Have you read this link? We’re talking about Korean males who’s sisters were quite likely killed in the womb for being the crime of being female. What sort of message are Korean mothers and Korean society (in Korea) sending to these boys? Not Korean fathers (in Australia) who cherish their daughters enough to give them a chance in a country that values a fair go?

    Meanwhile, the Ministry of Health and Welfare has been working on easing punishment for doctors who violate the law banning tests to discover the sex of a fetus. According to the ministry’s plan, doctors who violate the law prohibiting sex tests on fetuses will only be subject to a negligence fine, instead of the current three-year imprisonment or up to 10 million won fine.

  213. Matt Says:

    What I’m suggesting is, by promoting reverse racism it isn’t going to solve anything. At this rate by doing the exact same thing of making prejudice streotyped comments back at an entire nation based on the actions of the minority is equally as bad as these korean offenders that are being reported on the website, thus

    The thing is that this problem is not about individual offenders, but obviously something to do with the environment they are brought up in because it is so widespread. That does not mean that every Korean person is somehow guilty of it – they are not.

    I have some Korean male friends that are not like that at all, and to me they are all the more precious for it.

    Did you see the link I provided? This one? While you are at it you could also look here, and here. There will never be a solution to this if you just ignore the contributing factors to it, like where these ideas come from and just blame it on the individuals completely. Remember, they are as much a victim of their actions as the people that are directly affected by them. They cannot be very happy constantly being suspicious of the motives of the local people they live among.

  214. kjeff Says:

    Jenny,
    Whoa…you’re wasting your time here. You can copy and paste all the ‘evidence’ you want, and he won’t overlook the fact that you’re of Korean ancestry. OK, I’m partly responsible here, because like Matt said, he offered me to ban GarlicBreath from this site. I said no. Frankly, he fascinates me, sort of predictable in the unpredictable kind of way…don’t know if that makes sense. BTW, I must say that this site owes its continuance from the likes of GarlicBreath. Come on, THIS is a 200+ comment post?
    .
    Is this site ‘racist’?
    .
    Well, let’s just that many here are ‘uninformed’ and many more are simply ‘lazy’. Yes, few of them are blatantly spurring out ‘racist’ comments, but they seem to enjoy themselves so much, you can’t help but wonder whether they’re(the comments) born out of hate, or simply, out of boredom. I wouldn’t take them seriously…

  215. Matt Says:

    kjeff, where are you in the states? If I ever get back there, we have to go for some soju. My shout (Australian slang for “I will pay”).

  216. justice Says:

    Yes i said i found “nothing but kindness and acceptance.” Obviously this does not mean that “there is nothing but kind and accepting people in korea,” as recounted in your story. However you yourself say “We knew this was not typical of Korea. He was just a man who’d drunk too much soju.” My point exactly…so what are we arguing about here?

  217. Errol Says:

    # justice Says:
    November 1st, 2007 at 6:35 am

    what are we arguing about here?

    This …

    Matt Says:
    October 31st, 2007 at 11:07 pm
    Most of these guys … have grown up in Korea where they are members of the dominant race.

    In this case “these guys” … I am talking about foreign students and working holiday makers …

    Remember, I live in the CBD, so most of the people I come across are not suburban kyopo.

    And this …

    Errol Says:
    November 1st, 2007 at 6:20 am

    We’re talking about Korean males who’s sisters were quite likely killed in the womb for being the crime of being female. What sort of message are Korean mothers and Korean society (in Korea) sending to these boys? Not Korean fathers (in Australia) who cherish their daughters enough to give them a chance in a country that values a fair go?

    And this …

    Matt Says:
    November 1st, 2007 at 6:22 am

    The thing is that this problem is not about individual offenders, but obviously something to do with the environment they are brought up in because it is so widespread. That does not mean that every Korean person is somehow guilty of it – they are not.

    To summarise overbearing oppas on working holiday and student visas who swan about the CBD bullying Korean women. In Korea, normal oppas (whose parents don’t have the cash to waste sending overindulged prideful sons of Korea to Australia) restrain these overbearing holiday oppas.

  218. kjeff Says:

    Matt,
    I’m in Philadelphia now, but we’re thinking of moving to Minneapolis-St. Paul’s suburbs…been in the Northeast for too long…
    I can’t really remember whether I’ve been to Sydney…I must have when I was a child I suppose, but I spent several summers in Melbourne when I was younger. Are they different by much, socially and culturally?

  219. kjeff Says:

    If I remember correctly, my very first post here was about quantifier. It’s there for a reason; you’re not a census taker. Use it, people!!!
    P.S. Don’t copy GarlicBreath’s backhanded way…”Not all”. He sure is funny…

  220. Errol Says:

    One of the major environmental factors in this oppa behaviour is the freedom for oppas given by Korean courts.

    An appellate court gave the “not guilty” verdict to a (Korean) father who had touched his 11-year-old stepdaughter’s breasts, saying it was a “sign of affection.”

    Compare with the treatment meted out to Australian fathers for comparable crimes.

    A FORMER army sergeant caught playing naked Twister with his two stepdaughters has been sent to jail.

    District Court Judge Nick Samios said the man had clearly abused the trust of his stepdaughters and sentenced him to six months’ jail.

  221. Sweet Water Says:

    Is this site ‘racist’?

    Calling someone a racist is a serious accusation in developed countries. So, I am not comfortable to use a broad definition of racism to restrict other people’s opinion. Is it racism to criticize the backwardness of Korean culture of wife-beating and dog-eating (because not all Korean people beat their wives and beat/eat dogs)? Then, are we not allowed to criticize the backwardness of the Japanese of whale-eating? Should we prohibit any judgmental statements and subjective views against Korean culture or that of other ethnic groups (because that usually contains some generalization)? I personally don’t think so, but it’s up to the owner of this site.
    .
    Jenny, if I were a fellow Korean nationalist, I would probably beg you to stop screaming and return to this site later when your hwa-byung is gone. Your personal attacks against GarlicBreath would only tarnish the reputation of the glorious nation of Korea.

  222. HanComplex Says:

    Jenny should take the “The familyguy Challenge”: Walk around Darling Harbour on a Sunday afternoon with familyguy. Doesn’t have to hold hands or anything. Within 24 hours how many phonecalls will jenny get from disgruntled Korean punters? “Yo! What u doin’ with that white boy? He’s a playa! I’m a warnen’ uu!”

    If jenny backs down is she than admitting that Australian blokes are as described by dear old oppa?

    Here, here. I’d really like to see Jenny do this. It’s much better than going hwa-byung on this site with long-winded tirades. If she’s convinced her own kind are not as racist or xenophobic as posters are making them out to be, then it shouldn’t be a problem, right? Unless she’s afraid what was forewarned above will come to fruition.
    .

    Another anecdote to part with … Caught the subway one night with Australian friend and Indonesian friend. Korean male (singular) enters carriage and begins a rant. Rest of carriage was OK. i.e. Stereotyping the good Koreans (in public anyway as chaemyeon implies avoiding confrontation). “Shut the fuck up”, he screams. Again he yells, “Shut the fuck up. Shut the fuck up. Don’t speak English you dirty foreigners.”

    We exit the carriage and next stop and wait for the next train. My Australian friend says, “Wow! That’s never happened to me before.” Our Indonesian friend looks at us sadly, almost in tears, “That happens to my friends and I ALL the time.”

    During the tirade I apologised to the other (Korean) passengers in Korean that, We knew this was not typical of Korea. He was just a man who’d drunk too much soju.”

    But after the game, when the kids went out to eat, the person who put together the event only took the Korean kids, leaving Hines behind (Ward is of mixed parentage, his father an African-American). After that I told Hines to never hang out with Korean kids. Yet when we went to Korea in ’98, even Korean people who looked educated spat when we walked by. Koreans judge others based on their appearance and their age. Those kinds of Koreans think that they are so special…

    Not really surprised at all with incidents like these. Refer to my previous post.
    Still nothing wrong with Koreans or Korean culture? Time to get those blinders and rose-tinted lenses off.

  223. GarlicBreath Says:

    Seriously i pity GarlicBreath if his daily activity revolves around visiting Occidentalism each day to complain, bitch and moan and make generalised racist remarks everyday. What a sad life that is

    “jenny” I pity you.

    I have defended my remarks. Point by point.
    .
    Racist! I have proven not so. Shame on you. Do you see the dirt and filth of the lies have on your hands?
    .
    Yes you have admited that you YOU JENNY, are a racist. YES JENNY! Read here:

    Why don’t i pull a GarlicBreath. :p

    Calling Japanese people ugly is appropriate. They are short and stumpy and prone to buck teeth.

    “jenny” Please show me where I mocked corean phisical atributes. Never been done. Your faux GB comment just exposes your deep racism with japanese. I have never made similar comments.
    .
    Jenny… shame on your filty racism..
    .

  224. kjeff Says:

    Errol,

    One of the major environmental factors in this oppa behaviour is the freedom for oppas given by Korean courts.

    An appellate court gave the “not guilty’’ verdict to a (Korean) father who had touched his 11-year-old stepdaughter’s breasts, saying it was a “sign of affection.’’

    Compare with the treatment meted out to Australian fathers for comparable crimes.

    A FORMER army sergeant caught playing naked Twister with his two stepdaughters has been sent to jail.

    District Court Judge Nick Samios said the man had clearly abused the trust of his stepdaughters and sentenced him to six months’ jail.

    Apples and oranges…
    .
    Where do these people go to school?

  225. wiesunja Says:

    Basically, here is a great analogy which sums up the fallacy and stupidity of the arguments to which Jenny, Brian, and other “We Koreans can do nothing wrong and are always better than Japan, America or Australia” crowd subscribe. It truly is amazing how far Korean psychos will go to great lengths to somehow dismiss the selfish, racist, immature, barbaric nature of the Korean mind by saying that chauvinistic racist thinking applies only to a FEW Koreans, and that this type of thinking is common to people all over the world. What a load of horseshit.

    Let’s say that one were to write a travel guide for aliens from outer space visiting earth, what could one write to provide the aliens a fairly accurate representation of humans so that they may be able to distinguish humans from animals?

    Logical Person: You could write that humans have walk on two legs whereas animals walk on all fours or have more than 4 limbs.

    Korean: You can’t say that! That is a total generalization and totally wrong! I saw a human that had only one leg before so that is a totally false representation! Also, I saw a dog walk on two legs one time at the circus. Thus, what you said is totally false and untrue!

  226. alec931 Says:

    Matt:
    Just curious, where in Australia do you meet (I assume you mean actually having conversations with them) these “thousands” of Koreans?
    .
    .
    .
    .
    wiesunja,
    So are you defending your generalization of the “barbaric” Korean minds while criticizing “all” Koreans’ generalizations of Japan, America and Australia?
    .
    wiesunja: “Basically, here is a ****great**** analogy which sums up….”
    .
    HAHAHAHA!!!! Whatever helps you sleep better at night, fool.

  227. alec931 Says:

    Gorlicbreath: “Yes you have admited that you YOU JENNY, are a racist. YES JENNY! Read here:”
    .
    Please learn how to read the entire post and understand the concepts of “irony” and “satire”. But why am I wasting my time with a retard like you? sheesh…. :(

  228. General Tiger Says:

    After spending at least an hour reading all the replies, I have to say that I rather not go into this idiocy.
    .
    Matt, can you bring up a new thread or something so that we have something else to talk about?

  229. justice Says:

    Oh dear god, Garlicbreaths ability to continually miss the entire point of Jenny’s posts time and time again truly astonishes me, and it appears alec931 is the only one who realizes this.

    Garlicbreath your supposed “proof” that you are not a racist is based entirely on your own twisted definition of what constitutes “race.” But can you then “proove” that you do not at least discriminate based on ethnicity? To call Jenny a racist for her satirical parody of your behavior is ludicrous and just plain childish. As stated by alec931, please read her post in it’s entirety instead of simply taking parts out of context. More so, your apparent defense against this analogy is that you do not mock “physical attributes”? Are you suggesting that mocking behavioral, or rather attaching negative behavioral attributes to an entire race is perfectly fine?…just as long as you aren’t calling them “ugly” it MUST be ok…

    I’d also like to address this comment made by Sweet Water;
    “Then, are we not allowed to criticize the backwardness of the Japanese of whale-eating? Should we prohibit any judgmental statements and subjective views against Korean culture or that of other ethnic groups (because that usually contains some generalization)?”
    Again you miss the point, of course even i myself would criticize the backwardness of certain Japanese who eat whales, however i would not say “some japanese eat whales, therefore Japanese people are backward and underdeveloped.” Can you not see the distinction?

    Another point i feel i can’t leave is the supposed “great” analogy by Wiesunja;
    “Let’s say that one were to write a travel guide for aliens from outer space visiting earth, what could one write to provide the aliens a fairly accurate representation of humans so that they may be able to distinguish humans from animals?

    Logical Person: You could write that humans have walk on two legs whereas animals walk on all fours or have more than 4 limbs.

    Korean: You can’t say that! That is a total generalization and totally wrong! I saw a human that had only one leg before so that is a totally false representation! Also, I saw a dog walk on two legs one time at the circus. Thus, what you said is totally false and untrue! ”
    This clearly does not apply..allow me to explain why :)…The number of humans who walk on one leg are a very small percentage of the population, similarly are the number of dogs who walk on two legs, therefore in using this analogy you imply that while there is a very small percentage of the corean population that aren’t “backwards and underdeveloped,” the vast majority are? I would disagree. This “analogy” is just as ignorant and discriminative as anything else said.

    Lastly i have to address the neat little method you’ve all developed for dismissing Jenny’s very valid points. Her supposed “HwaByung.” Yes she’s angry and she has every right to be, but by dismissing her argument under the veil of this “Hwabyung,” it is clear that you simply can’t refute them :)

  230. Sweet Water Says:

    Again you miss the point, of course even i myself would criticize the backwardness of certain Japanese who eat whales, however i would not say “some japanese eat whales, therefore Japanese people are backward and underdeveloped.” Can you not see the distinction?

    No, it’s you, Mr. Justice, who miss the point. Actually, you doctored the evidence. Let’s go back to the original statements, because of which Jenny is accusing GB as a racist:

    What’s worse is they bring their backward and underdeveloped culture with them wherever they’re transplanted.

    and

    Calling corea backward is appropriate. Backwards, refers to backwards corean culture practices like wifebeating and dogeating. Dog eating and wife beating are not civilized.

    Can’t you see the difference, Mr. Justice?

  231. justice Says:

    No i cannot see the difference. and how exactly did i “doctor the evidence.” Shall i reiterate. I would personally agree that the practices of dog eating or wife beating are backwards (And so would Jenny for that matter), i would NOT say however “some coreans eat dogs and beat there wives therefore the entire nation and its people are backwards, and its culture underdeveloped.” Can you not distinguish between which comment is racist and which is not?

    The fact of the matter is that this statement IS racist “What’s worse is THEY bring THEIR backward and underdeveloped culture with THEM wherever THEY’RE transplanted.” “THEY” referring to coreans as an entire nation is a blatant generalization and implies that the underlying cause of such actions is the fact that they are corean. THIS IS THE DEFINITION OF RACISM.

  232. Sweet Water Says:

    You still don’t understand the difference. Okay, then, tell me who said “Korean people are backward and underdeveloped”? You understand what “a backward child” means, don’t you? If we use the adjective “backward” to people, especially, an entire ethnic group, we should probably be criticized as racists.
    .
    Now, you’ve sneakily modified the alleged statement to “the entire nation and its people are backwards,” so that it looks more similar to the expression by one of the posters. Again, who said that? Can’t you understand the difference between criticizing the backwardness of cultural practices and criticizing the innate intellectual ability of entire people?

    “THEY” referring to coreans as an entire nation is a blatant generalization and implies that the underlying cause of such actions is the fact that they are corean. THIS IS THE DEFINITION OF RACISM.

    Why don’t you stop lying? “They” are Korean ESL students in Australia who supposedly said (or implied by their behavior):

    “Koreans want to keep Korea Korean. We value our cultural ties to bloodline and a monoculture. This is what makes us Korean. We do not want foreign blood integrating with our own, for then we would no longer be Koreans.”

    http://www.occidentalism.org/?p=785#comment-30373

  233. Errol Says:

    alec931 Says:
    November 1st, 2007 at 3:17 pm

    Matt:
    Just curious, where in Australia do you meet (I assume you mean actually having conversations with them) these “thousands” of Koreans?

    Central Sydney. is full of Holiday oppas. World Square with Coles in the basement

    One of the problems with Holiday Oppas in Australia is their belief that as Korea was ranked higher than Australia in GDP then Australians are inferior. The holiday oppas would never try these tricks in the USA. This is probably why Mr kjeff hasn’t experienced the Holiday Oppa Phenomenon.
    .
    Oil has hit USD 95 a barrel and BHP-Billiton and Rio Tinto are going to up iron ore prices real soon and the Ozdollar is at 93 US cents. How long can the Holiday Oppas continue with their supremacist charades?

    # General Tiger Says:
    November 1st, 2007 at 3:48 pm

    Matt, can you bring up a new thread or something so that we have something else to talk about?

    Like the threads on the Marmot’s Hole’s posts on the public face of Samsung and the private face?

    See especially Post No. 5 by Linkd.

  234. Aude_Sapere Says:

    # General Tiger Says:
    November 1st, 2007 at 3:48 pm

    After spending at least an hour reading all the replies, I have to say that I rather not go into this idiocy.
    .
    Matt, can you bring up a new thread or something so that we have something else to talk about?

    I’m still waiting for your explication on “East Altai-Baikal Nationalism” and how it wonderfully justifies Japanese annexation and colonization.

  235. General Tiger Says:

    Aude_Sapere:

    it wonderfully justifies Japanese annexation and colonization.

    It doesn’t, because nationalism doesn’t equal to unification.

  236. Aude_Sapere Says:

    Alright. But the fact still stands that under such a concept of nationalism, there shouldn’t be a problem with “unification” that occurred when Japan annex Korea, since under that nationalism, it’s all the same people anyway.

  237. kjeff Says:

    Sweet Water,
    Since I started this whole ‘racism’ thing…let’s see,
    HanComplex wrote,

    What’s worse is they bring their backward and underdeveloped culture with them wherever they’re transplanted. Then you end up with people like Cho Seung-hui, Robert Kim, and thousands of Korean whores. It would really be in the best interest of these governments to limit or just ban their immigration. Then they’d have fewer things to worry about.

    That’s the whole paragraph, I didn’t edit anything. Clearly, he’s suggesting that Korean culture is “backward and underdeveloped.” Since culture is usually defined as “ways of living of an entire society,” how is it different from calling “an entire ethnic group” backward? Please note that in his comment, there were no mention of any specific cultural practices. BTW, this was after he called them ‘inbreds’.
    .
    GarlicBreath in HanComplex’ defence responded,

    Its very ugly of you to constantly try and paint people as racist if you don’t agree with them.

    .
    Its open to debate if corea is developed or not developed. Your supreme leader Nom Moo Hyun admits corea is not developed.
    .
    Calling corea backward is appropriate. Backwards, refers to backwards corean culture practices like wifebeating and dogeating. Dog eating and wife beating are not civilized.

    That’s also not edited. The first half is irrelevant and stupid; the man can’t differentiate between economy and culture. The second, which you’ve been valiantly defending is no less idiotic. Spousal abuse is a crime in South Korea; it is NOT a Korean cultural practice. Unfortunately, they happened, in Korea and elsewhere.
    You can agree or disagree whether dog-eating is a backward culture practice, but remember, only a fraction of what constitutes the ‘Korean people’ actually enjoy the practice. Is it “appropriate” to call “corea” backward because of that? I don’t know, you tell me…

  238. Errol Says:

    # Aude_Sapere Says:
    November 1st, 2007 at 9:37 pm

    Alright. But the fact still stands that under such a concept of nationalism, there shouldn’t be a problem with “unification” that occurred when Japan annex Korea, since under that nationalism, it’s all the same people anyway.

    Tell that to my Mongolian friends who suffer from the Holiday Oppa Syndrome.

  239. General Tiger Says:

    Aude_Sapere:

    since under that nationalism, it’s all the same people anyway.

    SO, you’re saying that under White Nationalism, every nations should be merged into a superstate?
    .
    Anyway, given that I probably shouldn’t write a paper on the topic, here are the summaries:
    .
    1. I’ve already been to most of Eastern/Southeastern/Southern Asia, and believe that my world view is already wide enough. Thanks for your advice, but I’m not the usual Korean Nationalist who’s a frog in a well.
    .
    2. The Chinese, if I use a somewhat strong word, are a MIXED race. Unlike the Koreans, Japanese, Mongols, etc, they are a “cultural” nation, a more unified version of the Melting Pot. Saying that they are a single race is ignorance. There are genetic evidences to back this up (done by the Chinese, of all people), and you should be able to google them.
    .
    3. Of course, given the status of Japan as a group of islands, one can’t expect them to be from a single place. However, the main stock of the Japanese, the Yayoi people, emigrated from the southern part of the Korean Peninsula to northern Kyūshū, (though it has also been proposed that they came from southeastern China)
    .
    4. You say that the land north of the “Great” Wall is mostly Han Chinese now. However, let me ask you this: Was this the case during the early 18th century? No, there were few Han Chinese, because the Manchus barred them from moving north, to preserve a secured homeland. Only when their power broke down with the clashed with the West did the Han flooded the land, with most of them coming after the fall of the QIng.
    .
    5. You’re incorrect in saying that the Manchus were assimilated into the Chinese. Unlike the Yuan, where the ruling Mongals did assimilate, the Manchus kept their bloodline as “pure” as possible. Research a bit into it, and you’ll see the false statement of how the Manchus are “Sinified.”
    .
    6. I consider the Koreans to have come into existence as an identity during the Goryeo era. During Shilla, there was still Jin/Balhae, of which the majority were former Goguryeo people. (Although researchers say he people of Balhae were made up of former Goguryeo elements and of several Tungusic peoples present in Manchuria, of which the Mohe (Malgal) made up the largest element, this isn’t compltely true, given that it’s based on the early records, when Balhae was a small nation. There’s no concrete record of the population during the height of Balhae, when it regained most of Goguryeo’s land, in which lived over 4 million Goguryeo people.)
    .
    7. My nationalism is similar to European nationalism, where which nation shares a common identity along with their national identity.

  240. Errol Says:

    kjeff Says:
    November 1st, 2007 at 9:46 pm

    Spousal abuse is a crime in South Korea; it is NOT a Korean cultural practice.

    If the law is capriciously enforced what does that make spousal abuse in Korea? 정?

    From the U.S. State Department

    Violence against women remained a problem. Between January and August, the Ministry of Justice registered 10,227 cases of domestic violence and prosecuted 1,114 cases. The Korea Women’s Hot line estimated in February that domestic violence occurred in 30 percent of households.

    Prosecution rate of about 10% and conviction rate? That would depend on the 정.

  241. kjeff Says:

    Errol…Errol…Errol,

    One of the problems with Holiday Oppas in Australia is their belief that as Korea was ranked higher than Australia in GDP then Australians are inferior. The holiday oppas would never try these tricks in the USA. This is probably why Mr kjeff hasn’t experienced the Holiday Oppa Phenomenon.

    Before I go to my next holiday spot, I’ll be sure to check her GDP…so that I know whether or not I should feel ‘superior’.lol…
    BTW, Australia has higher GDP per capita than that of Korea you dimwit, which is a better measure of whatever it is you’re suggesting.

  242. Aude_Sapere Says:

    Basically, my points and my beliefs are, for the most part, summed by your given point #2 and #3, that I see everyone is MIXED. Nationalism, in my opinion, is stupid, no offense.

    And you STILL didn’t directly address my point. I didn’t say all whites SHOULD merge into some superstate. I said, given a situation where it did happen, which it did with Korea/Japan, there shouldn’t be any problems, because they are, according to this nationalism concept of yours, its all the same.

    Of course now that you have FINALLY explicated what you mean, the thread will have to change.

    And actually, I think White Power movements do want an all-white nation free of everyone else.

    And maybe you should have just said point #7 from the very beginning. But regardless, you still didn’t really address that situation which I have presented.

    # General Tiger Says:
    October 28th, 2007 at 4:20 am

    Matt:

    Maybe I am dense but I do not know of that kind of nationalism at all. Care to explain what an East Altai-Baikal Nationalist is and believes in?

    Pretty much a nationalism centered on the Eastern wing of the Altai Language group people (Mongol/Tungus/Manchurian/Korean/Japanese).

  243. Errol Says:

    General Tiger Says:
    November 1st, 2007 at 9:51 pm

    5. You’re incorrect in saying that the Manchus were assimilated into the Chinese. Unlike the Yuan, where the ruling Mongals did assimilate, the Manchus kept their bloodline as “pure” as possible. Research a bit into it, and you’ll see the false statement of how the Manchus are “Sinified.”

    Yet another North Asian “expert” like Mr kjeff.

    Although it’s difficult to ascertain exact figures, there are probably fewer than 100 native speakers of Manchu left in China, almost all of whom are over 70 years old. The numbers of those who can write as well as speak it are even fewer.

    장군님 주말에 잘 지내세요!

  244. Errol Says:

    kjeff Says:
    November 1st, 2007 at 10:01 pm

    BTW, Australia has higher GDP per capita than that of Korea you dimwit, which is a better measure of whatever it is you’re suggesting.

    맞다! 그러면 자주 여행오바는 호주에 오면 경제를 실패했어요. ㅠㅠ

  245. Errol Says:

    죄송하지만 오빠! 도!

  246. General Tiger Says:

    Errol:

    Although it’s difficult to ascertain exact figures, there are probably fewer than 100 native speakers of Manchu left in China, almost all of whom are over 70 years old. The numbers of those who can write as well as speak it are even fewer.

    Then I suppose the Native Americans have been assilimated into “American” culture, destroying their identities?
    .
    Check.

  247. Jenny Says:

    Thank God someone has a brain around here. (Kjeff and justice)
    Is it such a difficult concept to understand? We’ve been addressing for the 1000th time. (That’s an exaggeration for you GarlicBreath so that you don’t go leaping at that and dismiss the entire content of this argument like you do with EVERYTHING)
    .
    Fact 1. No it is not right to EMPHASIS ONE’S ETHNICITY AS A FACTOR BEHIND AN I.N.D.I.V.I.D.U.A.L’S WRONG DOINGS. You CANNOT say “Coreans this Coreans that” as the CAUSE of one individuals wrong doings.
    .
    DEFINITION OF RACISM FOR THE 5TH TIME FOR YOUR DELLUSIONAL MIND TO UNDERSTAND:
    rac·ism (rā’sĭz’əm) Pronunciation Key
n.
.
    1. The belief that race accounts for differences in human character or ability and that a particular race is superior to others.
.
    2. Discrimination or prejudice based on race.
    .
    ‘coreans in Indonesia like those in the article are filthy animals.’
    “Calling corea backward is appropriate. Backwards, refers to backwards corean culture practices like wifebeating and dogeating.”
    “Coreans do take great offence when anybody challenges their chauvinistic and corea-centric view of the world”
    ‘Typical arrogance from a blind nationalist coreans.’ All by GarlicBreath, the epitome of RACISM.
    .
    Please read post 178, 179, 180 by me as well.
    .
    Fact 2. Yes I CONDEMN the equally racist Korean extremists as evident on this original article.
    HOWEVER, resorting to REVERSE RACISM as evident in GarlicBreath’s RIDICULOUS generalization of a nation consisting of 49million people is JUST AS LUDCRIOUS. Thus in NO BETTER POSITION TO BE THE ONE POINTING FINGERS AT, WHEN HE HIMSELF IS MAKING BLATANTLY RACIST REMARKS AND ISN’T AWARE OF IT.
    .
    Gosh how many times do I have to repeat this? Such STUPIDITY.
    Kjeff I heard you are a moderator of this site, I’m afraid people like GarlicBreath needs to get a ban for breeding racial hate.
    I’m scared to think GarlicBreath has been preaching this sort of racism for over 2 years and nothing has been done about it. (Should he have been active on this site since its beginning)
    PS: I completely agree with everything KJeff has mentioned on 237th post.
    Wife beating is a cultural practice? LMAO. Well in that case wife beating is a cultural practice in over 90% of this world GarlicBreath. LOL
    .
    This site seems to attract dellusional and misguided yet opinionated idiots who thinks they are an expert in sociology.
    Fuck sake, if you think you are so radical in your thinking that you think none of those things mentioned is racist, (when it doesn’t take much thought to feel the racist undertones) go enrol yourself at a university and try sharing with the world on your radical avant-garde new thinking. Let’s see how well that goes. LOL

  248. Matt Says:

    Jenny, you seem pretty focused on GarlicBreath, but how about replying to my comment here.

  249. Jenny Says:

    Ok, but how does this give you the right to generalise? How does this MINORITY of INDIVIDUAL extremists that happens belong to the same race reflect the attitude of the entire nation of 49 million people?
    Where in the name of racial discrimination excuses this?
    .
    If you don’t believe me why don’t you then elevate issue to the government organisations sine you seriously strongly believe in your stance, and go challenge the Anti Discrimination Act 1977. Ask them to exempt the use of racial generalisations when it comes to speaking about Koreans, use these articles as your backup. see what they say.
    .
    This is a question of common sense.

  250. Errol Says:

    General Tiger Says:
    November 1st, 2007 at 10:28 pm

    Then I suppose the Native Americans have been assimilated into “American” culture, destroying their identities?

    Yes. It’s just an occidental version of Gender and Internal Orientalism.
    .
    That most famous article by Louisa Schein that I’m certain that you and jenny have read. Thanks again oppa. :)

  251. General Tiger Says:

    Errol:

    Yes. It’s just an occidental version of Gender and Internal Orientalism.
    .
    That most famous article by Louisa Schein that I’m certain that you and jenny have read. Thanks again oppa.

    I don’t know what you’re talking about. Care to explain more about this person and the article?
    .
    Oh, and are you a girl? If not, it’s creepy to hear oppa, lol.

  252. kjeff Says:

    Matt,

    …contributing factors to it, like where these ideas come from…

    What do you think these “contributing factors” are? I think I managed to come up with several of them earlier…before I found out that the “Koreans” in your OP was specific to those who lived or are living in CBD for less than two years. Well, I’m always interested…

  253. Errol Says:

    # General Tiger Says:
    November 1st, 2007 at 11:30 pm

    I don’t know what you’re talking about. Care to explain more about this person and the article?

    This is why people respect you General. A man prepared to admit that he’s not an expert on sociology. Hmm unlike …

    Jenny Says:
    November 1st, 2007 at 10:46 pm

    This site seems to attract delusional and misguided yet opinionated idiots who thinks they are an expert in sociology.

    Back to the topic.

    General Tiger Says:
    November 1st, 2007 at 11:30 pm

    Oh, and are you a girl? If not, it’s creepy to hear oppa, lol.

    That’s one of Schein’s observations: the collusion of ethnic minority males in the subjugation of ethnic minority females. How perspicacious of you.
    .
    It’s quite a long article. “Gender and Internal Orientalism in China.” 1997. Modern China 23(1): 69-98. Try to get a copy from a library.
    .
    It’s a seminal work on how ethnic minorities are trivialised and disempowered in modern China.

  254. GarlicBreath Says:

    “jenny” you really have gone hwa-byung. And you lie.

    ‘coreans in Indonesia like those in the article are filthy animals.’
    “Calling corea backward is appropriate. Backwards, refers to backwards corean culture practices like wifebeating and dogeating.”
    “Coreans do take great offence when anybody challenges their chauvinistic and corea-centric view of the world”
    ‘Typical arrogance from a blind nationalist coreans.’

    “jenny” I see you have paired down my “so called racist” comments. Why not provide a link so people can read the full context?
    .
    What is your issue? I wrote that coreans are barbaric for eating dogs and wife beating. Coreans are well known for dog eating and wife beating. No not each and every corean spends all day eating dog and beating his wife. I don’t claim that. I am stating that both are a cultural practices of coreans that I find backwards.

    LMAO. Well in that case wife beating is a cultural practice in over 90% of this world GarlicBreath. LOL

    I think you belive that because you are coreans and think wife beating is normal.
    .
    Here is more on Corean domestic abuse. Is Suna lee a racist for discussing Corean domestic abuse. No? Hypocrite thy name is “jenny”. If you feel that wife beating is OK, then say it loud. I find this behavior backwards.

    The results show that even in the present day Korea, domestic violence is endless, and the rate is higher than one expects. According to a survey taken in 2004 by New Visions, about 22% of Korean residents have responded “yes” to personally experiencing or witnessing domestic violence. It proves that the Korean American communities do show the severity of domestic violence just as in South Korea.

    An old saying in corea.

    “A woman must be hit once every three days in order to preserve peace and harmony in the family.”

    .
    Now do I need to prove to you that dog eating is a corean cultural practice?

  255. General Tiger Says:

    Errol:

    That’s one of Schein’s observations: the collusion of ethnic minority males in the subjugation of ethnic minority females. How perspicacious of you.

    Well, it IS creepy when a guy calls you oppa, for some reason, lol.
    .
    Interesting article, I’ll try to get my hands on it. However, I’m not sure if it fits in with Aude_Sapere’s view, where he said that the Manchus were pretty much assimilated to nothing, therefore meaning that Manchu territory automatically became Han territory.

  256. General Tiger Says:

    GarlicBreath:

    Now do I need to prove to you that dog eating is a corean cultural practice?

    No, but how is it barbarous and backwards?
    .
    For me, eating goose livers is barbarous, not to mention the conditions of factory farms. Does that make the US a barbarous culture?
    .
    As we spoke before, backwardness in food should be based on how you treat the eaten, not on what you eat.

  257. justice Says:

    “What is your issue? I wrote that coreans are barbaric for eating dogs and wife beating. Coreans are well known for dog eating and wife beating. No not each and every corean spends all day eating dog and beating his wife. I don’t claim that. I am stating that both are a cultural practices of coreans that I find backwards.”

    This paragraph summarizes your dillusion. You say “No not each and every corean spends all day eating dog and beating his wife. I don’t claim that.” Yet directly above you admit to saying “COREANS ARE BARBARIC for eating dogs and wife beating,” which implies exactly that.

  258. Errol Says:

    Having spent quite some time in Dongbei the situation is a little more complex than the descriptions provide by yourself and Aude_Sapere have so far shown. Related to the Manchu situation is the marginalisation of the Joseonjok in Dongbei. Andre Lankov wrote an interesting article on Joesonjok in the Korea Times.

    However, college education is in Mandarin, and entrance exams are in Mandarin, too. The Korean parents know that Chinese language schools give their children better chances to go to college. The result is a dramatic decline in enrollment in the Koreans schools. In a middle school in Longjing where in the 1970s there were 400 students, now there are merely 39 students.

  259. kjeff Says:

    Jenny,

    Kjeff I heard you are a moderator of this site, I’m afraid people like GarlicBreath needs to get a ban for breeding racial hate.
    I’m scared to think GarlicBreath has been preaching this sort of racism for over 2 years and nothing has been done about it. (Should he have been active on this site since its beginning)
    PS: I completely agree with everything KJeff has mentioned on 237th post.
    Wife beating is a cultural practice? LMAO. Well in that case wife beating is a cultural practice in over 90% of this world GarlicBreath. LOL
    .
    This site seems to attract dellusional and misguided yet opinionated idiots who thinks they are an expert in sociology.
    Fuck sake, if you think you are so radical in your thinking that you think none of those things mentioned is racist, (when it doesn’t take much thought to feel the racist undertones) go enrol yourself at a university and try sharing with the world on your radical avant-garde new thinking. Let’s see how well that goes. LOL

    Hmmm…I’m not the moderator of this site. What I said earlier was that Matt, who is the moderator of this site, offered me to ban GarlicBreath, and I refused.
    .
    Jenny, I shared your frustrations, but I think you should look at some of the comments here with open-mind…I meant don’t try to ‘win’ them, you’ll be disappointed. There is no winning here because they don’t play by your rules. Why do I frequent this site? I spent a lot of time in my computer due to my work, and it gets boring sometime. And, it’s easy, and extremely fun to ‘bully’ people like GarlicBreath once you get to know their pattern; it’s a great stress relief.
    .
    Is he dangerous? Not at the least… I think the idiots who agree with him are just…well, idiots. They’re pretty harmless.
    .
    Is this site racist? Well, I haven’t read anything positive about Korea here…is that selective? Yes. Racist? No.
    I can’t see it already, someone is going to have ‘Samsung sucks’ links, or something similar.
    P.S. I will not entertain what’s good about Korea question…lol…

  260. General Tiger Says:

    Errol:
    Yes, I’ve also spent quite a bit of time in Harbin, and also have relatives there. It’s damn hard to actually get ahead in society when most of the economic growth is centered in Beijing and Shanghai, where you NEED to know Mandarian to survive.
    .
    That said, may I ask your opionion on my thoughts? I want to see if there’s anything I might need to fix up in my beliefs.

  261. HanComplex Says:

    kjeff Says:
    November 1st, 2007 at 10:01 pm

    BTW, Australia has higher GDP per capita than that of Korea you dimwit, which is a better measure of whatever it is you’re suggesting.

    Ah, as expected of Koreans. When they start losing an argument name-calling ensues. How predictable.

  262. HanComplex Says:

    If the law is capriciously enforced what does that make spousal abuse in Korea? 정?

    From the U.S. State Department

    Violence against women remained a problem. Between January and August, the Ministry of Justice registered 10,227 cases of domestic violence and prosecuted 1,114 cases. The Korea Women’s Hot line estimated in February that domestic violence occurred in 30 percent of households.

    Wow, spousal abuse is clearly NOT a Korean cultural practice. Imagine, only over 10,000 cases between an 8-month period and only 10% prosecuted.
    Without a doubt, Korea is the world’s most advanced culture especially when it comes to treatment of women. All those allegations of wife-beating are just hearsay and have no bases in reality, naturally.

  263. HanComplex Says:

    Speaking about the treatment of women in Korea, apparently if you’re a cop and assault women you can even win police awards.

    The police officer charged last month with robbing and raping three different women won recognition for outstanding performance from his department 18 times since 1989, according to National Police Agency data.
    .
    The policeman, who was not identified, was fired in 1997 from the department on charges of accepting bribes, then rehired in 1998 after a court found him not guilty. In August of that year, he won an outstanding performance award from the provincial head of police, according to the data.
    .
    Still, the man was transferred several times to different departments.
    .
    Kim Gi-hyeon, a Grand National Party lawmaker, asked for the police agency data during a National Assembly hearing. He said that innocent women became victims due to police negligence in managing the suspect.
    http://joongangdaily.joins.com/article/view.asp?aid=2881962

    Korea: truly, an advanced nation and culture. Fighting!!!1!

  264. kjeff Says:

    Jenny,
    Watch and learn…

    Ah, as expected of Koreans. When they start losing an argument name-calling ensues. How predictable.

    GarlicBreath, Wiesunja(you don’t see him/her much these days), and HanComplex will quick(and wrongly) to claim that their side is winning. The above is pretty typical. Obviously the “name-calling” thing is ironic, since he’s doing exactly the same thing. Glad he picked that up…(I wonder if he knows why I’m glad)
    But again, they’re not playing with the same rules…either they will deny, deny, and deny, or they’ll post unrelated and irrelevant other ‘negative’ sides of Korea. Get used to it.
    .
    I find all of these amusing.
    P.S. Note how I’m using you…

  265. kjeff Says:

    HanComplex,

    Wow, spousal abuse is clearly NOT a Korean cultural practice. Imagine, only over 10,000 cases between an 8-month period and only 10% prosecuted.
    Without a doubt, Korea is the world’s most advanced culture especially when it comes to treatment of women. All those allegations of wife-beating are just hearsay and have no bases in reality, naturally.

    I read that it’s estimated that there are 1-4 millions cases of domestic violence in the U.S. each year, do you know how many are prosecuted?

  266. Jenny Says:

    So you question me why I think you are racist and you then give me this response.
    ‘I think you belive that because you are coreans and think wife beating is normal.’ GarlicBreath
    Go figure you idiot. Let me give you the definition of Racism for the 6th time. 2. Discrimination or prejudice based on race.
    .
    Also where have I suggested that the wife beating is normal? And where are you drawing this ridculous GENERALISATION from again? *hint hint.*
    .
    Do I sound like a person that would if you actually read everything I’ve written?
    You missed my point once again.
    ,
    Am I proposing something radical and revolutionary concept that you shouldn’t emphasis one’s race as the cause of an individual’s negativity? I believe not. THIS IS COMMON SENSE.
    Why is it so difficult for you to understand the concept of Racism?
    Fact 1. No it is not right to EMPHASIS ONE’S ETHNICITY AS A FACTOR BEHIND AN I.N.D.I.V.I.D.U.A.L’S WRONG DOINGS. You CANNOT say “Coreans this Coreans that” as the CAUSE of one individuals wrong doings.
    .
    Is it ok me to make a racist claim like “Black Americans are stupid” drawing from the fact that their average IQ is below the white race? OF COURSE NOT. YOU CANNOT GENERALISE AN ENTIRE RACE, COMMON SENSE.
    .
    THIS ACCOUNTS FOR RACISM PERIOD.
    This goes for anybody elese on this website, such as HanComplex and his accusation of KJeff’s name calling purely because he’s Korean. “Ah, as expected of Koreans. When they start losing an argument name-calling ensues.”
    How racist and unintelligent is that seriously?
    .
    By the way, KJeff is pretty much the only SANE person on this website along with Justice and I.
    Should you find this hard to believe, I suggest you print out all your apparently not racist and legit writings show it to ANYBODY else in the streets, away from this website and see what they say. God, this is seriously like arguing that 1 + 1 = 2 to a bunch of dellusional yet extremely opinionated idiots. Thank god this is only a very small proportion of hunanity.
    .
    I was thinking of doing another satire of GarlicBreath so he can be spoonfed furthermore of his wrong actions, but I highly doubt he will understand the satire behind my writing as he couldn’t with my initial attempt on 166th post.
    .
    So sad, I shall live this mental ward of a website soon, as this is mostly definately killing my precious brain cells, dealing with ignorant and obviously mentally challenged dellusional hypocrital neo nazis with ear plugs tightly blocking their ears.

  267. General Tiger Says:

    Jenny:

    By the way, KJeff is pretty much the only SANE person on this website along with Justice and I.

    I feel hurt T_T
    .
    In seriousness… self-rightness will not get you far, Jenny. Watch what KJeff and I do.

  268. Jenny Says:

    Kjeff, I think these racists might be robots that are programmed to repeat the pattern over and over again.
    .
    Despite my many posts on how emphasising one’s race as a cause behind an individual’s wrongful characteristic is racist,(WHICH IS A FACT), the robot then replies to me with this :‘I think you belive that because you are COREANS and think wife beating is normal.” -GarlicBreath.
    Someone obviously missed out on a crucial part of education in his life, and yet he has the audacity to be point fingers at others. Oh the irony.
    Also no where in my previous posts have I approved of wife beating of ANY ETHNICITY (that includes Korea for garlicbreath’s pea size of a brain to get)

  269. Jenny Says:

    oh General Tiger is sane too :)
    Well anybody that believes GarlicBreath is racist is sane :)

  270. GarlicBreath Says:

    kjeff;

    I read that it’s estimated that there are 1-4 millions cases of domestic violence in the U.S. each year, do you know how many are prosecuted?

    Justice, does that sound like tu quoque. Let me guess; no. Any arguement that defends corea is acceptable to a nationalist.
    .

  271. Jenny Says:

    GarlicBreath you’ve lost your credibilty LONG LONG TIME AGO.
    .
    You can continue to chuck in random facts about Korea but that doesn’t exempt you from your lack of common sense to distinguish racism.

  272. General Tiger Says:

    GarlicBreath:

    Justice, does that sound like tu quoque. Let me guess; no. Any arguement that defends corea is acceptable to a nationalist.

    Howver, you use an universal problem to say that a certain nation is backward. That’s where it leaves the realm of tu quoque to the realm of prejudice.

  273. justice Says:

    “Justice, does that sound like tu quoque. Let me guess; no. Any arguement that defends corea is acceptable to a nationalist.”
    .
    Am i a nationalist now? I am not even korean, i’m just a sane and logical person like Jenny, Kjeff and General Tiger, and to me that “sounds” like Kjeff is trying to draw attention to that fact that you Codemn Coreans and only Coreans for this and not other nations. IT IS A PROBLEM IN COREA, and IT IS A PROBLEM EVERWHERE ELSE IT OCCURS. NO one is excusing it, we are simply pointing out that this behaviour is by no means definitive of Coreans and Corean culture.

  274. GarlicBreath Says:

    Jenny, you are a very rude young lady. Why don’t you act more like your sock Justice.
    .
    You still haven’t proven that I have said anything racist. You are just repeating over and over the same thing.

    No it is not right to EMPHASIS ONE’S ETHNICITY AS A FACTOR BEHIND AN I.N.D.I.V.I.D.U.A.L’S WRONG DOINGS. You CANNOT say “Coreans this Coreans that” as the CAUSE of one individuals wrong doings

    .

    Jenny, what would you like me to do, name each corean man that beats his wife and hand over a video tape that proves his actions and motives.
    .

    The results show that even in the present day Korea, domestic violence is endless, and the rate is higher than one expects. According to a survey taken in 2004 by New Visions, about 22% of Korean residents have responded “yes” to personally experiencing or witnessing domestic violence. It proves that the Korean American communities do show the severity of domestic violence just as in South Korea

    Look jenny.. the author of this study didnt list all the coreans in the study, they made a GENERALIZATION (all caps just the way you like it).

    By the way, KJeff is pretty much the only SANE person on this website along with Justice and I.

    Justice and you are the same person as far as I can tell. And the other guy is well known as being dishonest. LOL, no wonder tigg wanted in to the club.
    .

    lol.

    So sad, I shall live this mental ward of a website soon, as this is mostly definately killing my precious brain cells, dealing with ignorant and obviously mentally challenged dellusional hypocrital neo nazis with ear plugs tightly blocking their ears

    I knew the nazi line would pop up sooner or later. See godwin’s law. OK, go away then.

  275. kjeff Says:

    GarlicBreath,

    Justice, does that sound like tu quoque.

    Walk before you run, and crawl before you walk…”tu quoque”…tsk…tsk…tsk…

  276. justice Says:

    ” The results show that even in the present day Korea, domestic violence is endless, and the rate is higher than one expects. According to a survey taken in 2004 by New Visions, about 22% of Korean residents have responded “yes” to personally experiencing or witnessing domestic violence. It proves that the Korean American communities do show the severity of domestic violence just as in South Korea

    Look jenny.. the author of this study didnt list all the coreans in the study, they made a GENERALIZATION (all caps just the way you like it).”
    .
    Can you not distinguish between this and “coreans are barbaric for eating dogs and wife beating.” This article points out that there is domestic violence in South Korea, it doesn’t say “Koreans are barbaric because of their domestic violence.” Do you not understand how this is different?
    .
    And is it so shocking for this many people to disagree with you in your little insular world of internet anonymity that you have to conclude we are the same person? Nothing could be further from the truth, i just happen to share Jenny’s opinion on the issue.

  277. GarlicBreath Says:

    Mr Matt,

    Sorry for letting this thred jack go on. I feel I must respond to the stain on my good name.

    More on corean wifebeating:

    The abuse of foreign wives is not confined to women from Vietnam. Many foreign women getting married to Koreans in search of the “Korean dream” confront the stark reality of domestic violence, verbal abuse and discrimination in Korean society. Some of them fall prey to human trafficking. An annual U.S. report on human trafficking showed that a growing number of foreigners are trafficked to South Korea for sexual or labor exploitation though brokered marriages. The report carried a photograph of a billboard featuring adverts from marriage brokers advertising offering Vietnamese brides “who will not run away.” This indicates how serious the human trafficking issue is in the country.

    Look ‘jenny’ the article says “stark reality of domestic violence, verbal abuse and discrimination in Korean society” Look Jenny Look. It says “corean society” jenny.. its a generalization.
    .
    So Justice, are you saying that wife beating isnt barbaric? Jesus… the lengh a nationalist will go to in order to defend corea.

  278. justice Says:

    omfg…you just DO NOT get it….yes the article says “in korean society,” implying that such dispicable acts are undertaken by some individuals in korean society. This is not the type of generalization you use, if you were to say it it would be more like “Coreans are violent and abusive and discriminatory, see? look at this statistic,” implying that the underlying cause for such acts is that fact that they are Corean WHICH IS RACISM. An example of this is “coreans are barbaric for eating dogs and wife beating.”
    .
    And where exactly did u get the notion that i do not find wife beating barbaric? Untrue, its very barbaric. HOWEVER, just because SOME barbaric Coreans take part in this barbaric activity, it DOES NOT mean that “Coreans are barbaric.” THAT IS RACISM.

  279. kjeff Says:

    GarlicBreath,

    Mr Matt,

    Sorry for letting this thred jack go on. I feel I must respond to the stain on my good name.

    No need to apologize…he does not read your comments. Oooohhh, is that GENERALIZATION? “My good name”….how did you use to write that laughing sound?
    .
    Justice(and Jenny),
    You…what are you goals here?

    So Justice, are you saying that wife beating isnt barbaric? Jesus… the lengh a nationalist will go to in order to defend corea.

    He will never get it…he has no shame…read the above again and again, and really… think whether your method so far can ever be effective to someone like him?

  280. wiesunja Says:

    Jesus… the lengh a nationalist will go to in order to defend corea.

    Garlic Breath, I feel your pain. But you see, Korean racist psychos hate generalizations about their own country, Korea. On the other hand, they revel in masturbatory bliss when it comes to generalizations about other countries and people. Look at what Jenny wrote below:

    How does this MINORITY of INDIVIDUAL extremists that happens belong to the same race reflect the attitude of the entire nation of 49 million people?

    You’re right Jenny. Yeah…I think because I know so many people who were born with only 9 fingers, it is totally wrong to say that humans have 10 fingers. Obviously, because I know so many people who have fewer than 10 fingers, I know the human race better than any other person and anyone else who says that humans have 10 fingers is a fool.

  281. wiesunja Says:

    Basic rule of thumb is that Koreans love to dish it out, but hate it when others give them a taste of their own medicine. Unfortunately, this site is the only one it seems in which Koreans are dealt a taste of their own ugliness first hand. Pretty much every other Korean themed website on the entire internet is full of typical Korean racist nationalistic trolls spewing racist filth about Japanese, Chinese, Vietnamese, Westerners, and other “sub-Asians”. And no…Koreans can’t just stop there and be satisfied with containing their ugly racist filth and garbage on their own sites…they have to spread it and infiltrate other nation-themed websites because of their insecurity and inferiority complex. Their favorite target seems to be Japan-themed websites. It’s quite hilarious because in every single Japan-themed website or blog, I rarely see many Japanese-nationals posting but instead, these sites are full of Korean racist trolls who swarm like cockroaches feasting on rotting flesh. I guess their insecurity-filled hunger of having to always badmouth Japan, US, China or other nations is such a genetically uncontrollable urge that they have to go and hijack every single thread concerning these other nations with insults and rude, barbaric comments. Case and point, just go to Youtube and search for any video about Japan. You won’t find any Japanese commenting…instead you will find a swarm of ugly comments made by Koreans posing as other nationalities to try to make it seem as though anti-Japanese sentiment is common to even non-Koreans. However, the rotten kimchi and jealousy/inferiority complex-fueled childlike hatred gives them away. No other country in the world is as stupid and immature as Koreans to the point where they obsess about following and degrading Japan like some mentally sick stalker. Other sites where you will see hordes of Koreans trying to hide under multiple IDs or falsely portraying themselves as other nationalities as if it empowers them to say the same rude, racist filth against Japan or China are sites like http://www.japantoday.com, http://www.china-one.com, etc.

    On the other hand, other than this site, you hardly see any western, Japanese (not sure about Chinese) going into Korean websites just to make derogatory comments about Koreans. Simply put, western people or Japanese (or any other people for that matter) simply do not care or obsess about Korea like the same way Koreans do about these other people. This is so telling of the HUGE difference in maturity and confidence between most civilized nations in the world and Korea. You don’t see hate sites dedicated solely for Korea made by these more developed countries like you do for the hundreds and thousands of Korean made internet hate sites dedicated soley for Japan or the US. This fact makes the complaining and whining of all the Korean nationalist idiots on this site even more amusing since it seems like they really hate hearing anything negative or critical of Korea. On the other hand, the biggest joy and source of happiness for them is making filthy rude derogatory comments about Japan (Case and point: Brian, WJK, etc..who are the absolute worst). If they hate hearing anything negative of their beloved, “Our people can do no wrong” Korea, why don’t these trolls just go and take their pick of all the millions of hate-Japan, hate whitey websites that their Korean brethren are running all over the internet so they can revel in ecstasy and masturbatory bliss?

    Koreans…such interesting but hilariously pathetic creatures.

  282. Matt Says:

    Ok, but how does this give you the right to generalise? How does this MINORITY of INDIVIDUAL extremists that happens belong to the same race reflect the attitude of the entire nation of 49 million people?
    Where in the name of racial discrimination excuses this?

    What do you mean, “generalise”? I am pointing out a societal trend, a shared opinion or belief among Koreans that is widespread. It is not about individual extremists since the actions of the oppa that I wrote about are not considered extreme by Koreans.

    If you don’t believe me why don’t you then elevate issue to the government organisations sine you seriously strongly believe in your stance, and go challenge the Anti Discrimination Act 1977. Ask them to exempt the use of racial generalisations when it comes to speaking about Koreans, use these articles as your backup. see what they say.

    You have totally lost me. If you think there is something illegal about my sincere and truthful observations, feel free to report me.

  283. justice Says:

    “Justice(and Jenny),
    You…what are you goals here?
    He will never get it…he has no shame…read the above again and again, and really… think whether your method so far can ever be effective to someone like him? ”
    .
    I know kjeff you are so right as usual :/..but there is a reason i am still here and trying and a reason you are. Because despite the fact that arguing this is like debating the importance of Jews in the economy to Hitler, i simply can’t let this kind of racist hatred go in the year 2007…These are seemingly a new breed of racists that have somehow deluded themselves that they are perfectly rational and unbiased, and it disgusts me :(
    .
    Now its become quite clear that another method of dismissing our arguments these people have developed is by labelling us “Korean nationalists.” I’m sorry but i do not fit that category. I am not Korean, or even asian for that matter. My interests actually lie predominantly in Japanese culture however i cannot stand racism in any form. You can’t dissmiss my arguments under the veil of your racist generalizations. I am an Australian like many of you :)
    .
    “I know so many people who were born with only 9 fingers, it is totally wrong to say that humans have 10 fingers.” It bores me to once more point out the obvious but this analogy implies that the number of Koreans who aren’t “barbaric” or “backward” is as small in ratio as the number of humans with less than 10 fingers. This analogy clearly doesn’t apply and it is as racist as anything else you say.
    .
    “Koreans…such interesting but hilariously pathetic creatures.” Are you honestly still trying to claim that this isn’t racism? COULD YOU SERIOUSLY DEFEND THIS REMARK? What is this sentence implies that you are not talking about Koreans as a nation of people, and are simply referring to certain practices or groups? How does this not imply that the reason for such negatives, is the fact that they are Korean? I challenge you to defend this, but most likely you will either ignore it, or pick on an irrelevant, trivial issue to distract from the main one. As Kjeff says, you all follow a very obvious pattern that one quickly picks up…

  284. General Tiger Says:

    Okay, Jenny, Justice, you guys are becoming GarlicBreath/HanComplex yourselves. Knock off the flames.

  285. HanComplex Says:

    Aww, Tiger. Does criticism of Korean culture equate to flaming? And here I was thinking you were more level-headed than the likes of kjeff or Brian. I’m so disappointed. :-(

  286. HanComplex Says:

    Basic rule of thumb is that Koreans love to dish it out, but hate it when others give them a taste of their own medicine. Unfortunately, this site is the only one it seems in which Koreans are dealt a taste of their own ugliness first hand.

    I think this is a good description of the Korean psyche. Koreans are not used to criticism and revel in the alleged greatness of their culture such that when a single criticism comes up challenging their raised image of themselves they become very defensive and start crying foul.
    .
    The great irony is, if you point out their xenophobia towards non-Koreans as related in this blog countless times they deflect and marginalize their own kind’s racism, saying “it happens everywhere,” “that’s racist to say that,” or, with people with lower intelligence/hwa-byung tendencies/can’t argue, resort to name-calling (e.g., kjeff to Errol) or vulgarity. This double standard is so telling and glaring it’s not even funny. More than anything it points out to a collective inferiority complex and strong sense of insecurity that seem to permeate the Korean psyche. It’s difficult for the typical Korean to think outside the box and see this, as the nationalist brainwashing is so deeply entrenched in their culture and thus they have such a high regard for themselves and their race.
    .
    That’s why I’m really glad this blog exists. It’s probably one of the few websites in the world that points out the ugly and hypocritical side of Koreans that they don’t want to see, admit or made known to the world. And there’s lots of it.

  287. GarlicBreath Says:

    “jenny”/justic I think you should look at which login sock you are using when you reply.
    .

  288. GarlicBreath Says:

    It is a national shame that foreign wives living with Koreans have suffered spousal abuse. This issue surfaced again on Tuesday when Vietnamese President Nguyen Minh Triet asked the South Korean government to help Vietnamese married to Korean men lead better lives here

    Jenny justice, look.. look.. “living with Koreans” but not ALL coreans do that right.. its a generalization. Somebody should tell Vietnamese President Nguyen Minh Triet the he should focus only on the postitive things about corea, and if he talks about the negative things he is racist… right ‘jenny’ justice?

  289. justice Says:

    What the hell is a “login sock?” I suppose your implying we are on in the same, which is not true, but can not be proven or disproven anyway so it’s irrelevant…exactly as i predicted in my post…”you will either ignore it, or pick on an irrelevant, trivial issue to distract from the main one.”

  290. GarlicBreath Says:

    …”you will either ignore it, or pick on an irrelevant, trivial issue to distract from the main one.”

    You say this as you ignore my post. Hypocrite

  291. justice Says:

    I did not ignore it actually if you look at the time it was posted it was just 5 minutes before, hence at the time i was writing that post i hadn’t seen it yet. I will address it now even though i have addressed this very issue countless times now. He says “It is a national shame that foreign wives living with Koreans have suffered spousal abuse,” this is not a racist statement. However if he were to say “Koreans are abusive people,” that would be, just as your statement “Koreans are barbaric for beating wives and eating dogs,” or wiesunja’s
    “Koreans…such interesting but hilariously pathetic creatures” is.

  292. General Tiger Says:

    HanComplex

    Aww, Tiger. Does criticism of Korean culture equate to flaming? And here I was thinking you were more level-headed than the likes of kjeff or Brian. I’m so disappointed

    No, the criticism (although illogical at times, but that’s mostly Garlic) is okay, but attacking those who are against your criticisms is flaming.

  293. Sweet Water Says:

    Jenny said,

    Despite my many posts on how emphasising one’s race as a cause behind an individual’s wrongful characteristic is racist,(WHICH IS A FACT), . . .

    Nobody has discussed Korean traits and made hasty conclusions based solely on an individual’s wrongful characteristic. Regarding wife-beating, for example, it’s not a unique incidence by a criminal:

    According to Korea Times on October 2, 1997 the Korean women were the number one group victimized by domestic violence compared to other ethic groups (Cited from Steve k. Lim, “Domestic Violence among Korean Americans & The Importance of Family”).

    A nice thing of this blog is that it collects hundreds of anecdotal (as well as statistical) evidences, many of those related to Korea, so that we can get some sense/tendency about who the Koreans are. Also, thousands of comments posted by Korean people and those of Korean ancestry (including you) help me understand how they think, react, behave . . .

    By the way,

    GarlicBreath you’ve lost your credibilty LONG LONG TIME AGO.

    If that’s the case, why are you still bothered by his comments?

  294. kjeff Says:

    Matt,
    Yeeeaaahhh…6 more until it’s a 300 comment thread. Anyway, I was just listening to metropolitician.org’s podcast #25 again, and I feel like I can understand your experience better. If you haven’t, it’s worth listening.
    .
    It’s a shame that in these hundreds of comments, very few were actually addressing the issue.
    .
    SweetWater,

    A nice thing of this blog is that it collects hundreds of anecdotal (as well as statistical) evidences, many of those related to Korea, so that we can get some sense/tendency about who the Koreans are. Also, thousands of comments posted by Korean people and those of Korean ancestry (including you) help me understand how they think, react, behave . . .

    Really? I was wrong then…GarlicBreath/HanComplex/Wiesunja/Errol/Aokiookami are indeed dangerous.

  295. Brian Says:

    Holy shit! Looks like Garlic-face, Matt and Han-complex got owned 200 times. Great job Jenny! You may think that people like Garlic-face aren’t listening, but there are many non-posting readers who are. Keep it up!

  296. kjeff Says:

    Exchange Japan with Korea, and you got a new thread
    .
    4 to go…

  297. Matt Says:

    Matt,
    Yeeeaaahhh…6 more until it’s a 300 comment thread. Anyway, I was just listening to metropolitician.org’s podcast #25 again, and I feel like I can understand your experience better. If you haven’t, it’s worth listening.

    I enjoy reading Michaels blog, but rarely listen to the podcasts, but I will give the one you recommended a listen.

  298. MarkA Says:

    Make that two to go.

    I screwed up and married one, so my empathy is overwhelming.

    Throw my hat in the ring.

  299. Errol Says:

    Sweet Water Says:
    November 3rd, 2007 at 5:43 am

    Also, thousands of comments posted by Korean people and those of Korean ancestry (including you) help me understand how they think, react, behave . . .

    How do Koreans think, react, behave …? The gangs of oppas drunkenly roaming the inner city streets of Sydney? A Holiday Oppa pack rapaciously preying on Korean females lonely, far from home, strangers in a strange land?
    .
    This is the DaeHanMinKook State. But it is also clear that the denial of collective deindividuating altered states of consciousness corresponds with our present social formation, which mirrors and ratifies the rationalization processes of the society at large and finds its most powerful philosophical expression in the romantic existentialist apotheosis of the self.
    .
    A mob reared on raucous imbibing in innumerable MTS (Membership Meeting).
    .
    Apotheosis of the self. That is Korea. As a Korean friend described it to me, the bullying culture of Korea operates on a simple premise; “Surrender or die.”

  300. Sweet Water Says:

    GarlicBreath/HanComplex/Wiesunja/Errol/Aokiookami are indeed dangerous.

    You know, Aokiookami is on your side. He’s not dangerous but somewhat different from other Koreans.

  301. Sweet Water Says:

    Kjeff says,

    Exchange Japan with Korea, and you got a new thread…

    Why not? Suppose you called Japan as a barbarous country, would Jenny/Justice accuse you as racist exactly in the same manner as she did GarlicBreath? We’ll see.

  302. kjeff Says:

    302 and counting,
    When you feel is tough being white…
    Also, watch similar videos, they’re all hilarious…

  303. justice Says:

    “Why not? Suppose you called Japan as a barbarous country, would Jenny/Justice accuse you as racist exactly in the same manner as she did GarlicBreath? We’ll see.”
    .
    Yes.

  304. General Tiger Says:

    Errol:

    Apotheosis of the self. That is Korea. As a Korean friend described it to me, the bullying culture of Korea operates on a simple premise; “Surrender or die.”

    A question: is the bullying culture of other countries any different?

  305. Errol Says:

    # General Tiger Says:
    November 4th, 2007 at 6:05 pm

    is the bullying culture of other countries any different?

    The antecedents of Korean bullying are different. The lack of natural resources creating a zero sum mindset and culture of revenge when a new ruler can only enrich himself by impoverishing everyone else.
    .
    The vicious paybacks of spurned lovers to female counterparts. cf Oh Hyeon-kyoung, Baek Ji-young, Ok So-ri, and now Ivy.
    .
    Male on male, female on female, male on female and even female on male. In China and the rest of the world, if you lose something the place is big enough to try again. In Korea, the loss of face results in unbearable hwabyoung.

    But the Oppa Pack mentality? Your point being that it’s akin to a lynch mob, nigger hunt mentality that exists in other cultures? I agree with that observation with an additional observation. The man who stands up to the bully is celebrated in western culture from the Spartans (and their helots) at Thermopylae to Shane to Gordon Brown.
    .
    But in Korea kowtowing is the way to get ahead and if you wait long enough to become a seonbae you will also get ahead.
    .
    Its better to die on your feet than to live on your knees.

  306. oranckay Says:

    I would like to suggest you write these oppas a guidebook to Aussie women.

    If not, perhaps you could recommend: _How to Date a White Woman: A Practical Guide for Asian Men_
    by Adam Quan

  307. Errol Says:

    Very droll oranckay.
    .
    The Oppa Pack behaviour is based on a mindset that treats women like chattels. Major reform of Korea’s social system is required before that will change.
    .
    Romantic: Like the Romans. The only ancient culture where women were allowed to independently own and inherit property. Independent means allowed them to choose male partners based on love.
    .
    Pragmatic: Both jk and sumo have made numerous mentions (on The Marmot’s Hole and The Lost Nomad) of Korean women chasing them for their money. To the credit of both these Korean-Americans they preferred romanticism to pragmatism.

  308. Errol Says:

    Ooh, the irony. High school girl blows off oppa, Gangnam style.
    .
    Not to be confused with the at Marmot’s Hole. full salon rumpus room
    .
    For those who read Korean here is oppa in all his glory.
    .
    200 clubs in Gangnam alone. St kjeff is that a stereotype or a generalisation?

  309. Errol Says:

    Thanks in advance nuna!
    .
    Looks like the suburban Korean women in Australia are going to elect a woman to oust the prime minister.
    .
    Now the heat can be turned on the oppa packs that roam inner Sydney by the suburban Koreans who value women as people not as chattels.
    .
    Quote from male suburban Korean: “The Korean community is emerging into the middle class. House ownership is around 60 per cent and with six interest rate rises they are finding it harder to pay their mortgages. I think they are satisfied that Labor will provide a stable government and so it is OK to make change.”

  310. Errol Says:

    Another secret member of the Oppa Pack. Mr Byeon Yang-kyoon!

    At least that’s what he’s called in the vernacular version of the Joongang Ilbo.

    (검찰) 문자메시지에서 ‘오빠’라고 지칭한 인물이 변 전 실장이 맞습니까?

    (신씨) “네.”

    But Oppa didn’t make it to the English version.

    :(

    No thanks to oppa but thanks to Korea’s Finest.

  311. Errol Says:

    Obba? The rather curious spelling that the Donga Ilbo uses for members of the Oppa Pack. First Shin Jeong-ah ‘fesses up to calling Byeong Yang=-kyoon in the morning session with the prosecutors.
    .
    When asked whether “Obba (brother)” in her text messages online using one of the mobile numbers from November 2004 to January 2005 refers to Byeon, Shin answered in the affirmative.
    .
    In the afternoon Byeon confesses to being the oppa in question.
    .
    Byeon said, “Yes, but I don’t remember the number.” Byeon said, “I stored her mobile number on the phone and gave it a quick dial setting. I did not use the phone for reasons other than calling her.” He also said that he received her text messages calling him “Obba.”
    .
    And in Gangnam they sing it tonight
    .
    Obba-di obba-da life goes on without a bra
    .
    Lala, how the life goes on
    .
    Obba-di obba-da life goes on without pants or bra
    .
    Lala, Oppa life goes on

  312. HanComplex Says:

    LOL, Errol.

    By the way, have you heard the news of the popular Australian gal on K-TV who’s engaged to a Korean guy?
    http://english.chosun.com/w21data/html/news/200712/200712040017.html
    .
    I’ll leave you to comment on that one. ;)

  313. Errol Says:

    Of more concern to the Oppa Pack Mr HanComplex is how they are going to deal with an Australian woman like Penny Wong.

    Australian Labor Party politician Penelope Ying-yen “Penny” Wong (Chinese: 黃英賢; pinyin: Huáng Yīngxián, born November 5, 1968) is the current and first Australian Minister for Climate Change. She has been a member of the Australian Senate since 2002, representing South Australia. Wong is the first openly gay member, and the first Asia-born member, of the Australian Cabinet.