Occidentalism
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Slow posting

July 18th, 2007 . by Matt

Sorry everyone for the slow posting. I have been incredibly busy at work, busier than I have been in my life, in fact. I will get my stuff in order and return to posting at a normal rate next week. Thanks for reading.


118 Responses to “Slow posting”

  1. comment number 1 by: egg

    stumpjumper

    Sorry to get back to you late.

    Never mind.

    I used to travel around Japan on a bicycle

    I hope you enjoyed it.

    happened to come across many of those museums in rural resort areas. Usually the signs for those museums are weired and freakish, and I never had a courage to step into one of those

    When I come across one of them, I would like to go into it. Hope that my courage lasts. 🙂
    And thanks for the information about the smile mark.

  2. comment number 2 by: Errol

    Mr kjeff your naivete makes you easy prey for the Korean propaganda machine.

    But perhaps like an agent provocateur you only pretend to be naïve, as you have inadvertently admitted, acknowledged, confessed that most Korean female prostitutes enter the Korean prostitution industry at the age of 14, as shown by this link about Korean female prostitutes at age 14.

    What of your contention that 49 year old Korean women are not employed in the Korean prostitution industry. They work as mamasans and cleaners in the redlight districts, as receptionists in the room salons, as service providers in the eeyongwons and put on a miniskirt to work in the dallanjujeoms.

    … how many girls do you see out there, you’d be willing to pay to have sex with? If your answer is close to 1/5 you see, let me know what city you’re living? I used to live a little north of SoHo, the supermodel capital of the world, and even 1/10 would be pushing it.

    You lived in some place in Seoul and saw very few attractive women? Why should you? They work at night driven to their assignations by the vast numbers of men also working in the Korean prostitution industry. Behind the walls of your neighbourhood Russian women are also working in the Korean prostitution industry. Did you see any? Of course not. You’re not meant to see them. It’s all part of the policy of eejungjokida. The two-faced policy of this engine of economic growth.

    Female prostitutes in the Korean prostitution industry earn four times the average income? You’re assuming that there aren’t a million men leeching off these women to reduce average earnings. From hairdressers, to drivers, to the little boys who distribute the little cards on car windshields and hotel entrances, to the young ajeossi who cut up the watermelon and bananas and bounce defaulting ajeossi from the room salons, to the men who carry the crates of beer upstairs and manage the adjacent pc-bang where the young women are recruited, to the touts who accost ajeossi in the streets, to the waiters who drag women over to the waiting Korean boys and ajeossi in booking clubs, to the boyfriends who protect the girls from stalkers and are rewarded with motorbikes and Warcraft games, to the recruiters who speak Russian, Thai, Vietnamese and Indonesian, to the pimps who double-park Beemers outside nightclubs; truly Korea is a paradise for some of these.

    At home the Korean wives wait patiently for the return of their alcoholic husbands to return from their trysts with prostitutes, the divorce rate skyrockets, the cycle continues, no one will halt the root cause of this problem, the creation of Korean males by indulgent mothers to whom every whim is granted in the vain hope of gaining entrance to a famous university. By the time the child is in primary school and clearly no Einstein it is too late. The incorrigible arrogance that is characteristic of Korean males suffering from Narcissistic Personality Disorder will blight the lives of every person with whom they come into contact.

    Is there a solution? No, there is no solution while Koreans and their apologists deny that there is a problem. The problem is too embedded in the Korean social structure. The yangban mentality. The famous university fraud. The hagwonning kids through school. The non-verbal violent solutions to criticism instead of talking a way through a problem.

    For expatriates it is a moral dilemma; should an expatriate live in such a world as a collaborator in evil, or part of a resistance group that is trying to change Korean society?

    Mr kjeff, you criticise the resistance forces of the expatriates in Korea on this site for trying to make Korea a better place. Look into your heart and consider your obligations to the Korean, Russian, Filipino, Thai, Vietnamese and Indonesian women and Korean men (some of whom must swallow Korean pride and are rooted in victimhood) in the Korean prostitution industry. Join us in the Korean Anti-slavery Society!

  3. comment number 3 by: kjeff

    Errol,

    At home the Korean wives wait patiently for the return of their alcoholic husbands to return from their trysts with prostitutes, the divorce rate skyrockets, the cycle continues, no one will halt the root cause of this problem, the creation of Korean males by indulgent mothers to whom every whim is granted in the vain hope of gaining entrance to a famous university. By the time the child is in primary school and clearly no Einstein it is too late. The incorrigible arrogance that is characteristic of Korean males suffering from Narcissistic Personality Disorder will blight the lives of every person with whom they come into contact.

    Is there a solution? No, there is no solution while Koreans and their apologists deny that there is a problem. The problem is too embedded in the Korean social structure. The yangban mentality. The famous university fraud. The hagwonning kids through school. The non-verbal violent solutions to criticism instead of talking a way through a problem.

    Errol…one aspect of your problem is you tend to lump a lot of issues together, and you didn’t provide any argument why they should be. For example, what makes you think that prostitution contributes to the “skyrocketing” of divorce rate? Yes, having an affair is one of leading cause for divorce, but there you contradict your own argument of the “Kim syndrome.” If we have always been adulterer, I asked this before, what changed? What this gotta do with that NPD that you keep mentioning? There’s nothing wrong with talking about issues, but I’m hoping for a more articulate and honest discussion. First, let’s start with the facts.

    Female prostitutes in the Korean prostitution industry earn four times the average income? You’re assuming that there aren’t a million men leeching off these women to reduce average earnings. From hairdressers, to drivers, to the little boys who distribute the little cards on car windshields and hotel entrances, to the young ajeossi who cut up the watermelon and bananas and bounce defaulting ajeossi from the room salons, to the men who carry the crates of beer upstairs and manage the adjacent pc-bang where the young women are recruited, to the touts who accost ajeossi in the streets, to the waiters who drag women over to the waiting Korean boys and ajeossi in booking clubs, to the boyfriends who protect the girls from stalkers and are rewarded with motorbikes and Warcraft games, to the recruiters who speak Russian, Thai, Vietnamese and Indonesian, to the pimps who double-park Beemers outside nightclubs; truly Korea is a paradise for some of these.

    If those were how the 4% calculated, yes, the number makes sense. BUT, that’s just plain misleading. Where do you stop? Because the overlaps extremely exaggerates the figures. And without an honest estimation(I’m guessing that the Ministry of Gender and Equality “cooked” it to justify the ban), there’s not much we can talk about. Don’t tell me that if I were working as a valet in a room salon, I’m actually a sex industry worker…

    But perhaps like an agent provocateur you only pretend to be naïve, as you have inadvertently admitted, acknowledged, confessed that most Korean female prostitutes enter the Korean prostitution industry at the age of 14, as shown by this link about Korean female prostitutes at age 14.

    I don’t see the link.

    You lived in some place in Seoul and saw very few attractive women? Why should you? They work at night driven to their assignations by the vast numbers of men also working in the Korean prostitution industry. Behind the walls of your neighbourhood Russian women are also working in the Korean prostitution industry. Did you see any? Of course not. You’re not meant to see them. It’s all part of the policy of eejungjokida. The two-faced policy of this engine of economic growth.

    Are you trying to say that most of the pretty girls are prostitutes? That’s absurd.

    For expatriates it is a moral dilemma; should an expatriate live in such a world as a collaborator in evil, or part of a resistance group that is trying to change Korean society?

    Mr kjeff, you criticise the resistance forces of the expatriates in Korea on this site for trying to make Korea a better place. Look into your heart and consider your obligations to the Korean, Russian, Filipino, Thai, Vietnamese and Indonesian women and Korean men (some of whom must swallow Korean pride and are rooted in victimhood) in the Korean prostitution industry.

    I’d love see more expatriates trying to make Korea a better place, but I’m afraid I can’t see how the things you wrote accomplish that. Again, the lumping suggests a certain something else… Is Korea perfect? Of course not, I can probably list a dozen immediate problems off-hand, and I can probably explain why they come about, and why they’re difficult to change. You, on the other hand, merely ‘see’, if that… I don’t to know if you’re currently living in Korea, or was…but from little little things that I picked up, you seem to lack even the basic knowledge Korean history. I have a theory…I always feel that expats who seem to know a lot about Korea’s night life, and not much of anything else…are just hanging with the wrong crowd. My wife had a classmate, who by his own admission(and he has a MEd from an Ivy League and not your average deadbeats) went to work to Korea to “pick up girls.”

    Join us in the Korean Anti-slavery Society!

    So, are all forms of prostitution slavery? There’s the same problem again, no? How about we pick AN issue, and talk rather than merely listing them. Your choosing… BTW, I don’t see anything wrong with ‘willing’ prostitution; it fulfill a need, especially in Korea where you can’t just dress up on Friday night, and with a bit of charm and booze, ‘go home’ with a girl.(Or, maybe you can…never tried) Girls don’t have the same problem I guess… Forced prostitutions are obviously wrong, and there’s nothing much to talk about there, except the lack of police protections.

  4. comment number 4 by: HanComplex

    Mr kjeff, you criticise the resistance forces of the expatriates in Korea on this site for trying to make Korea a better place. Look into your heart and consider your obligations to the Korean, Russian, Filipino, Thai, Vietnamese and Indonesian women and Korean men (some of whom must swallow Korean pride and are rooted in victimhood) in the Korean prostitution industry. Join us in the Korean Anti-slavery Society!

    Errol, quite frankly kjeff isn’t the one to be having a conversation with about goings on in Seoul in the first place since he’s never actually lived there. Personally I think He just defends anything Korean since he’s married to a Korean and has a Korean mother. Additionally since he’s only half Korean (or claims to be) he must feel some strange psychological need to compensate for this and believes he can do so by siding with anything Koreans do, even if it’s wrong or he’s not making sense, e.g., nitpicking on posts, doing strange math calculations, feeble attempt at wit, etc. If you’ve been reading his posts from way back you’d know this by now.

    Is there a solution? No, there is no solution while Koreans and their apologists deny that there is a problem. The problem is too embedded in the Korean social structure. The yangban mentality. The famous university fraud. The hagwonning kids through school. The non-verbal violent solutions to criticism instead of talking a way through a problem.

    Bingo. That’s what I’ve been trying to say. Koreans continue to deny that’s there a problem or worse, cover it up. Saving face and putting up appearances seem to be more important, never mind if it only exacerbates the problem. That’s why people like kjeff and others do more harm than good with their face-saving and denial tactics. Seriously, there’s really no need or use to hide anything, since the whole world can see the ugly side of Korea and Koreans thanks to the Internet. For Koreans to keep on acting as if no problems exist, it only makes it worse and even harder for them to cover their lies. If they were smart enough they’d know that by now.

  5. comment number 5 by: kjeff

    HanComplex,

    Errol, quite frankly kjeff isn’t the one to be having a conversation with about goings on in Seoul in the first place since he’s never actually lived there. Personally I think He just defends anything Korean since he’s married to a Korean and has a Korean mother. Additionally since he’s only half Korean (or claims to be) he must feel some strange psychological need to compensate for this and believes he can do so by siding with anything Koreans do, even if it’s wrong or he’s not making sense, e.g., nitpicking on posts, doing strange math calculations, feeble attempt at wit, etc. If you’ve been reading his posts from way back you’d know this by now.

    And, Can I assume that you’ve lived in Seoul? Or, perhaps have more than half Korean blood running through your veins? If not, maybe you studied Korean history/culture in college? Or, if that’s not even so, maybe you are fluent in Korean language, and did your own research, no? OK…if all of those are ‘NO’, maybe you’ve lived/worked in a large Korean community, have a lot of Korean ‘friends’? What are your qualifications HanComplex, that makes you an ‘expert’ as to ascertain that “I’m not the one?” Now, that’s pure laugh…

    Bingo. That’s what I’ve been trying to say. Koreans continue to deny that’s there a problem or worse, cover it up. Saving face and putting up appearances seem to be more important, never mind if it only exacerbates the problem. That’s why people like kjeff and others do more harm than good with their face-saving and denial tactics. Seriously, there’s really no need or use to hide anything, since the whole world can see the ugly side of Korea and Koreans thanks to the Internet. For Koreans to keep on acting as if no problems exist, it only makes it worse and even harder for them to cover their lies. If they were smart enough they’d know that by now.

    Remind me of this

  6. comment number 6 by: GarlicBreath

    Personally I think He just defends anything Korean since he’s married to a Korean and has a Korean mother. Additionally since he’s only half Korean (or claims to be) he must feel some strange psychological need to compensate for this and believes he can do so by siding with anything Koreans do, even if it’s wrong or he’s not making sense, e.g., nitpicking on posts, doing strange math calculations, feeble attempt at wit, etc

    Spot on HansC, spot on.

  7. comment number 7 by: Errol

    kjeff Says:
    August 5th, 2007 at 10:07 pm

    this link about Korean female prostitutes at age 14.

    I don’t see the link.

    No problem?

    My apologies for not linking the article before. The problem is not as you say,

    except the lack of police protections.

    But why are Korean men having sex with 14 year olds?

    As you say,

    BTW, I don’t see anything wrong with ‘willing’ prostitution;

    What’s ‘willing’ about 14 year olds? They’re vulnerable. They are easily exploited by Korean males with Narcissistic Personality Disorder to whom normal concepts of morality do not apply.

  8. comment number 8 by: kjeff

    Errol,

    But why are Korean men having sex with 14 year olds? What’s ‘willing’ about 14 year olds? They’re vulnerable. They are easily exploited by Korean males with Narcissistic Personality Disorder to whom normal concepts of morality do not apply.

    Hmmm…you must not have checked out the link I provided, otherwise it’s kind of silly to argue the above. Hint: Is having sex with 14 year olds the norm or the exception?
    Here’s hoping for a better reading skill…you wrote,

    …confessed that most Korean female prostitutes enter the Korean prostitution industry at the age of 14, as shown by this link about Korean female prostitutes at age 14.

    Here’s the link that you provided as a source,

    About 20 percent of teenage prostitutes in the southeastern port city of Pusan began working in the industry when they were under 14 just for money, according to a survey.

    The Pusan Metropolitan Police Agency Friday released the survey of 85 teenagers and 157 men who were caught engaging in the sex trade in the city last year.

    1. 20% is not “most”.
    2. Pusan is not the whole Korea; it’s not even Seoul.
    3. “Teenage prostitutes” is only part of the “female prostitutes,” which makes your “most” even more…hmmm…
    4. Don’t you think 85 is a wee bit small sample size for population of ______ millions.
    You might be tempted to think, “Well, you’re just nitpicking,” but really what you wrote, your argument was a complete departure from your own source…and when you do this often enough, I don’t think one can just discard it as a simple ‘mistake’, but it becomes a willful distortion, based on certain prejudice and agenda. Please watch the YouTube video I linked earlier, pretty please…and you’ll get the sense of what you’re trying to do with the 14 years old thing. Wait…I’m relying on the fact that if you’re an expat in Korea, you’re probably somewhat well educated and not an O’Reilly fan, yes? “As people do better, they start voting like Republicans – unless they have too much education and vote Democratic, which proves there can be too much of a good thing.” Karl Rove
    P.S. Tsk…tsk…tsk…I’m assuming that everyone knows that “willing” also means that you pass the age of consent, whatever it is in Korea. Pleazzee…

  9. comment number 9 by: Errol

    kjeff Says:
    August 6th, 2007 at 9:23 pm

    based on (your) agenda.

    It would be more accurate to call it a thesis. But hardly my thesis. That would be plagiarism.

    The Korean Thesis

    1/ A significant proportion of Koreans are perceived to be untruthful. Whether they are or are not truthful is irrelevant to the following analysis. Perception is all that is necessary.

    2/ What is the best strategy for truthful Koreans to adopt in such a situation as 1/ given that they fear being taken advantage of by “cunning” Koreans?

    3/ The best strategy is to believe that everyone else is lying and lie oneself. Including lying to oneself.

    4/ What are the implications for Korea’s ambitions to become a hub of certain global service industries that rely on honesty?

    5/ Service industries does not include Korea’s prostitution industry, which also includes a component of dishonesty, in its “bait and switch” trick.

  10. comment number 10 by: kjeff

    Errol,
    (stress)WHAT??? What’s your point again?
    Hey…I’m just curious, what style were you using for your works cited? You cited several economic journals(Economics major I’m guessing), so I thought you might be using APA or Chicago, but they don’t look like them. It’s not MLA either I think. Maybe old APA? Anyhow, to stay on point…
    1. What?
    2. What?
    3. Sounds like talking to yourself there.
    4. Implications of what?
    5. Never said so…although I do remember you wrote something about the hairdresser… BTW, where’s the bait and where’s the switch?

  11. comment number 11 by: Errol

    Just something I read by the world-famous Kor-Am

    the Fabulous baduk.

  12. comment number 12 by: kjeff

    Errol,
    What are those got to do with anything?

    Dream on with the hubs of finance and logistics, no one believes they are viable, least of all sophisticated Koreans.

    The above is why this is so hard to believe…

    …trying to make Korea a better place.

    Just something I read by the world-famous Kor-Am

    I’ve never seen this blog before, but one word(time/event appropriate)…SUMMIT. How many of those are wrong already? Well, five months to go, but so far, every single thing is wrong. Hmmm…

  13. comment number 13 by: Errol

    The above is why this is so hard to believe…

    …trying to make Korea a better place.

    But Korea will be a better place if people are more honest or adopt the sophisticated response of cynicism to avoid being ripped off.

    cf. Mr Elgin’s post on the Marmot’s Hole titled

    Den of Thieves.

    Intellectual property rights? That would require the Korean judiciary playing which strategy?
    Hub of Honesty.

  14. comment number 14 by: kjeff

    Errol,
    It’s starting to get nowhere…desperate perhaps…

    But Korea will be a better place if people are more honest or adopt the sophisticated response of cynicism to avoid being ripped off.

    cf. Mr Elgin’s post on the Marmot’s Hole titled

    What is this? Spam is uniquely Korean? Pleeease!

    Intellectual property rights? That would require the Korean judiciary playing which strategy?

    First, don’t want to discuss an old thread. Second, shouldn’t really want to act like a beacon for intellectual property rights, no? Practically invented the art of RE in the 60s. Well, not you…but a certain she, who is being compared to in that thread.
    See the direction you’re going. You know, there are a lot, I mean a lot, of things wrong about Korea that needs fixing. And, I welcome any legitimate criticisms.
    Criticism should be a mean for change, a starting point, but I’m afraid ‘yours’ are merely the end; they just strive to ridicule, and nothing else. I suppose that’s fine too, if that’s your kink, but please, drop the ‘a better place’ charade.

  15. comment number 15 by: Errol

    kjeff Says:
    August 9th, 2007 at 1:46 am

    strive to ridicule

    The only ridiculing is of yourself by yourself.

    e.g.

    kjeff Says:
    August 5th, 2007 at 10:07 pm

    Don’t tell me that if I were working as a valet in a room salon, I’m actually a sex industry worker…

    Mr kjeff, the readers of this site are sophisticated (i.e. not naive) enough to recognise a euphemism for a pimp.

    How many friends of yours work/worked as valets? Are you naive enough to believe that they are your friends because of your wit, charm and admiration of their lifestyle? Or did they befriend you to obtain access to Indonesian gangs wanting to export women to Korea?

  16. comment number 16 by: Errol

    True Story

    First Man: Oz Accountant.
    Second Man: Moi
    Third Man: Naive American engineer a few months in Korea.

    [Scene 5 Star ‘Otel in Korea]

    First man: Have you met Third Man’s girlfriend?

    Second man: No, but he’s talked about her.

    First man: What did he say?

    Second man: He said she ran a florist shop.

    First man: [Snorts] A florist shop! … She’s a hooker.

    Second Man: How do you know?

    First Man: She’s a 200 000 won an hour hooker … Look at her she’s over there with him.

    Second Man: [Looks over at table] She looks like a hooker.

    First man: I’m going to tell him.

    [At this point in the conversation Mr kjeff (if present) would interject]

    Mr kjeff: You shouldn’t tell him.

    First man: Why not?

    Mr kjeff: Happy are the naive. I’m happy.

    First man: Better to be unhappy now than even unhappier when her “valet” stops cutting up watermelons and shows up to slap her around.

    Mr kjeff: I don’t know why I hang out with you dude. You always take the sparkle out of Korea.

  17. comment number 17 by: GarlicBreath

    Mr kjeff: I don’t know why I hang out with you dude. You always take the sparkle out of Korea

    That made me laugh. But I must disagree. Any Korean worth his salt would assume that any C-girl mixing with a non-Corean is already a whore. Nevertheless a Corean man would still feel it is his right and obligation to confront any mixed race couple. He would remind her that she is a whore, and yet object to the relationship, and for that matter, complain to her pimp that she is dirtying herself with foreign customers, and has a foreign boyfriend. The Coreans I know, have a zero-sum mindset regarding “their” women.

  18. comment number 18 by: egg

    Nothing related to the proceding arguments but what do you think about this news?
    Is this kind of thing common in countries which became independent over 60 years ago?
    It will make people living outside S.Korea hesitate to move their capital into S.Korea, won`t it?
    I have no intention to criticize S.Korean government`s decison because it is not my business. But I am quite puzzled. Won`t it damage S.Korean economy and credits?